New conservaties

[123everton]

Is the Tory complaint about Labour's idea to sell of assets justified?
Given that they sold most everything in the 80s for a fraction of it's true value to fund tax cuts for the rich.

[Kromovaracun]

I haven't read the thread, but I'd like to point something out.

To accuse the Tories today of hypocrisy on this issue the way you've done is grossly unfair. True, it's the same party that sold off public assets (and in several cases mishandled them by under-selling them in too much of a rush), but it's not the same people running the party. Fact of the matter is that especially in two-party systems, the main parties tend to be highly factional and it's also a historical fact that different factions become ascendant at different times.

With the exception of Osbourne, it's not entirely clear which faction the Conservative leadership as a whole belongs to. And even if they do all belong to the same ideological faction, Osbourne still isn't the one who under-sold the SOEs. So calling the Tories hypocritical is a little bit (unintentionally) blinkered.

[Kromovaracun]

"(I've had several arguments with Kromaracum about deregulating the banks)"

Have you? I think that might be someone else. I can only remember the huge one about the Thatcher legacy. Plus I generally avoid embroiling myself in the banks debate as I don't think I know enough...

[123everton]

I seem to remember arguing several times with you about the deregulation of the credit industry etc.

[rov1200]

If the banking crisis had not happened the UK would still be heading for the rocks and in a way has masked the problems we faced. We are the sick man of Europe. One of the first to enter the recession and one of the last to exit. This was a man who sold our gold reserves at a knock down price. Now we are putting up for sale items that can only sell below their true worth. It could be put on a par with someone destitute and uses the pawnbroker or back street lender charging high interest. Germany and France are not in our position as they can steer their way out.

Maybe its all down to this guy?

http://www.annaraccoon.com/politics/the-sick-man-of-europe/

[Gromit]

The only problem with your hypothesis is that it is not true. Germany was in recession before the UK, and France has not weathered it any better than us. The UK was far more affected by the collapse of the Financial institutions as London is a major Fanancial centre, and that has added to our woes.

" Germany, Europe's largest economy, is deepest in the mire, with its economy contracting by 0.2 per cent in the third quarter of 2008 after falling 0.4 per cent in the previous three months.

Italy and other members of the eurozone joined Germany in the recession club.

France, the eurozone's second-largest economy, narrowly avoided the R- word, with its economy managing a 0.1 per cent increase in the July-to-September quarter.

The Spanish economy contracted for the first time since 1993 in the third quarter, shrinking 0.2 per cent compared with the three months to June.

Britain, steadfastly outside the eurozone, suffered a 0.5 per cent fall in economic growth in the third quarter but its zero growth in the previous period saves it from the recession stigma."

http://www.smh.com.au/business/nation-of-europe-in-recession-20081115-67n3.html

[jno]

ABerrant, yes, full credit to Blair and Brown for continuing with Thatcherite economics. My point was merely that the pickle we're in isn't a socialist pickle as some have suggested, it's a capitalist one.