Labour Government

[Ward-Minter]

Can anybody give me an example of how this Labour Government has improved their way of life. I know the ideology of "socialism" takes a more 'macro' approach and intends to better society rather than the individual, but are their any ABers who have individually benefitted. If school classes have became smaller, have their kids improved? If there are more Police, has the local burglar been caught? If the NHS has improved, have their waiting time decreased. Has local Govt. improved their streets? Has the improved public transport system made their journeys easier?   etc etc etc etc etc.

[jno]

London's been less clogged with traffic when I've been there, though technically that's down to the mayor, who'd been flung out of Labour at the time. The weather has improved. Takes much longer to see my GP, but that's because the old one retired and hasn't been replaced - presumably the only solution would be for the NHS to order someone to take her place, but would that be the sort of socialist interference with the market you'd hate?

[january_bug]

I've experienced better access to GPs, my Dad's seen class sizes come down at work and more resources for education, the trains have improved a hell of a lot, the money's been made available to councils to invest in recycling facilities, my Nana had a shorter waiting time than expected when waiting for a place in psychiatric care, I could go on. 

We'll never know whether it would have been better under the Tories.  But let's face it, they won't be coming to power for a while if they can't even sort themselves out with a decent leader.  I never hugely approved of Thatcher (I wasn't really old enough at the time, but I mean from what I've read, which is stuff that is neutral, as well as biased in each direction), but she's the last decent leader they had. 

I know there are a lot of people who tihnk we should all hate the government, but sadly you just won't succeed.  I think they're doing a decent job given the circumstances, and life for us is on average better than in some comparable countries I'm sure.  And we just don't know what the Tories would have done with the same situation, so it's hard to decide if life is better or worse than if the Conservatives had got in. 

[Zen]

Improved Transport system ????
You must be a city slicker,up here in Lincolnshire we're still waiting for the Stagecoach to arrive !!!!!!!!!!!!

[january_bug]

Well I'm not in London if that's what you think.  The transport systems are partly our own fault... collectively we use the cars too much so the demand falls, and then when we need a bus... there isn't one. 

I still maintain... do you think the buses/trains would be better under the Tories?  That's what the question is really asking, I believe. 

[january_bug]

PS - Stagecoach are a pretty dreadful company who make their money on very dodgy ground and have destroyed many local public transport networks.  If you haven't got them yet... thank your lucky stars!

If you meant Stagecoach as in the old fashioned carriage thing.. then sorry for being thick! *blushes*

[Solarjunkie]

Personally,as a part time worker, I get holiday pay for the first time.

I actually work full time, but for more than one company, so for many years all my time off has been unpaid.

So thisABer hasindividually benefitted.

[Slow Ride]

Socialism, very lazily defined, is the belief that the state control of the means of production improves the welfare of the nation better than the invisible hand of the free market. What distinguishes a socialist from a Conservative is almost entirely a question of political economy; a socialist frowns upon the casino that is the free market, whereas politicians on the right, traditionally at least, embrace consumer sovereignty. If you were to compare the socialist hatred of the free market to Blair�s zeal for globalization and his unshakeable belief that consumers know what�s best for the country, you�ll soon see why only the politically confused in this country label the current Labour government a socialist government.

Indeed, this Labour government is light-years away from being socialist. A true socialist government would not have ditched Clause 4, thereby renouncing its commitment to nationalization and effectively eliminating trade union control of the party; nor would it have made the Bank of England independent, a move that not even Thatcher would have contemplated � like a good socialist, she preferred state control of the Bank. Moreover, a socialist government would not run the vital public services like a business.

What we have in Britain is not a Labour government but a New Labour government � something very different. Blair�s adoption of neo-liberal economic policy was central to the creation of New Labour. By carefully presenting free market policies in a way that appeals to the most influential elements of the British left, Blair has seized control of the political middle ground, the control of which is essential for electoral victory. Controlling the middle ground has meant that voters have struggled to differentiate Labour policies from those of the Conservatives; this, of course, has spelt disaster for the Tories, who again hope that new leader will rejuvenate their fortunes.

[Slow Ride]

Now: to your question. Given that there is very little material difference between the Conservatives and New Labour, can you reasonably expect an improvement under a Tory government? I would be prepared to bet there would be very little difference in your lot. Of course, the presentation of policy would be different, there would be different rhetoric, a different spin, and the whole immigration and security issue would no doubt be brought to the forefront by a Conservative government, but there would be no real difference.

In actual fact, any government, regardless of political persuasion, would fail to meet satisfactorily all the criteria you outline in your question. This is not only because it does not allow for the plurality of causes involved in socio-economic phenomenon, such as crime, but also because it wrongly conflates local and central government. Although connected in some way, local and central government are two very different organs of the body politic. There has, for some time now in the UK, been a conflict between local and central government. Let�s say, for instance, the crime rate in a region is reduced. To what should we attribute that success - to central government policy or to that of the local government? Say the crime rate has dropped in an area. Who takes the credit? Perhaps nobody; maybe the local burglar just retired and is now sunning himself in the Costa del Crime. Pinpointing the exact causes for social and economic improvement is always a tricky and controversial task.

[Slow Ride]

Personally, I haven�t seen an improvement in my life under this government. But then I didn�t see much of an improvement under the Major government either. This is no surprise; you can�t expect a government to solve your problems. Your happiness, believe me, depends on more complex factors than government policy. If you are happy, you tend not to notice that the train was delayed. On the other hand, if your lover had jilted you that day, the late arrival of that train would infuriate you, creating the illusion in your mind that transport policy is the most pressing issue of the day.

It�s always best to solve your problems yourself as you are better placed to do this than politicians. In any case, politicians are the same everywhere: they promise to build bridges even when there are no rivers. There is no political Father Christmas. Sorry.

[Ward-Minter]

Blimey slow ride. You know your onions dear boy.

[kazza12345]

i can think of two example - firstly, i am better paid (i work in the nhs)

secondly, my husband has ahad an operation that has improved his quality of life, but was not seen as essential (although it seemed pretty essential to me) and it wasnt deemed to be available  on the nhs when the conservatives were in poiwer

[january_bug]

Slow Ride - that answer was a pleasure to read!  If other users were able to give 3*s, I would! :-)

[Slow Ride]

Thanks Ward-Minter and january_bug. Nice to know it was useful - extra nice to know that somebody enjoyed it, too.