2 bedroom house sold as a 3 bedroom house

[vitchicus]

Hi all.

ok - I bought a house 3 years ago and it was advertised and sold as a 3 bedroom. the 3rd bedroom being a loft conversion - this is my main bedroom.

a friend asked if I'd ever seen any certificates for this - I hadn't - so i contacted the council as to if everything was ok, they say no building regulation forms were ever submitted (this conversion was done in the 80's) - they say I can fill one out and it's going to cost in the region of £400.

The question is - have I been missold this property on the basis of it being a 3 bedroom? and if so can I do anything about it? nothing was ever mentioned about the attic room.


Cheers

[ummmm]

I don't think the estate agents are required to check out any building certs for the houses they take on.

[sandyRoe]

Wasn't it your lawyers job to look into that side of things?

[Davethedog]

I think that your solicitor should have examined the deeds and performed due diligence.

[vitchicus]

yeah I would've thought someone was accountable. well, other than myself. I didn't even know these things existed when I was buying, I thought that's what the solicitor was there for.....

[vitchicus]

I'm pretty sure nothing was ever mentioned - I got the basic surveyors report....structural etc. they did inspect the attic though I remember them saying it was done in the 80's but nothing was reported on it.

i'm going to check all the paperwork out when I get home.

What are the implications of me not obtaining a certificate? I'm guessing I won't be sent to prison or oredered to have it de-converted will I? :-)

[vitchicus]

well the valuation was the price of 3 beds.... that's what I mean - everything appears to be based on 3 beds..... but without any certificate for the 3rd bedroom.

[Count-A-Strong]

Did you tell the |Building eg's dep't that it was done in the 80's, as it may be that BRegs weren't required when it was carried out. The regs on 'habitable' loft spaces have only recently been tightened.

[vitchicus]

ahhhhhh - hang on....something seems familiar now....like I've heard that before - I think you might be right, it might not have applied back then....yes I mentioned it in a long email to them - he may not have paid any attention to the 1980's bit.... he may think it's a recent conversion

[Count-A-Strong]

Best to check as you will have probs when you come to sell it.

[Davethedog]

Vitchicus - a word of advice, don't wind the council up. It is unfortunate but if you have to pay it, pay it.

All sorts can happen if you don't

[vitchicus]

i've just got a reply from him - he's been very nice....he just says they won't take any action if I didn't get it done due to the timescales of it being converted. but says it would be advisable to regularise the conversion or buy some idemnity insurance.

[donna1901]

it is the solicitors job to check on al lthe planning permission hun. i looked at a house which had a loft conversion and they were very upfront and said i do not have planning permission for this so technically its not classed as a room! The estate agents new this would throw a spanner in the works for the sale to complete as they were advertising something which technically wasnt allowed due to regs! so the value of the property had to be dropped

[vitchicus]

I wouldn't mind, but it's a very cosy 3rd bedroom....grrrr, very anxious now - going to have a proper look through all the paperwork.... I may have to pull my solicitors eyes out.....stupid houses

[buildersmate]

Here's a definitive summary for you (that also corrects various bits of mis-information above).
There was a requirement for Building Regulations approval for this work back in the 1980s.
The BR approval doesn't 'certify' the property as a 3 bedroom house - it establishes that the conversion was designed to a suitable minimum standard and that the design was followed reasonably correctly (this is done by inspection).
In theory the BR department could demand retrospective action to demonstrate the structure is sound back after 20 years are unlikely to do so - as you have been told.
This is NOTHING whatsoever to do with Planning Permission, as some bright spark above suggests.
Technically it was missold, but after 3 years your opportunity for action is limited - what are you wanting to do? - make a civil claim for damages against the estate agent?
Because it can't be claimed as a 3 bedroomed property, as the attic room should really only be described as 'storage space', that impacts the free-market valuation - however a valuation is only an average opinion by a professional of what someone would pay for it - you thought it was worth what you paid for it, so why are you worried?
Your solicitor should have found this out - it is part of the standard enquiry sheet solicitors ask sellers to complete. There is a question something along the lines of 'has the property ever been converted or modified and if so please provide copies of planning consent and/or building regs approvals. Your best recourse now is to write to your solicitor requesting he/she extracts the files from archive to check for this point. Either the seller lied on the response form or your solicitor was potentially negligent if he failed to ask the question.
But taking legal action now on the basis of this may not be something you wish to do - it costs money and there is no guarantee you will win.