ChatterBank1 min ago
Falkland Islands
Is it time we relinquished these, and save the massive cost of defending them?
If the Argies attack again, we won't have the capability to oust them again.
If the Argies attack again, we won't have the capability to oust them again.
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The Falkland Islands are over 200 miles off the coast of Argentina so can't be said to be right next to that country (personally I'd like to invade France and claim back Normandy - Brittany even better!). The Maoris and Aborigines have 'more right' to New Zealand and Australia but I doubt anybody would consider giving those countries back to them. You can't re-write history and the Falkland islands have been British for longer than they were ever Argentinian - not that they ever were officially.
The inhabitants are British and most of them are fierce monarchists and I think we have a moral duty to protect them and their wishes.
LadyEyre, I'm sorry about your brother and son but people in the armed forces surely have to accept that the possibility of grievous injury or death goes with the territory. At least the islanders are truly grateful which is more than can be said for some countries we helped in WW2.
The inhabitants are British and most of them are fierce monarchists and I think we have a moral duty to protect them and their wishes.
LadyEyre, I'm sorry about your brother and son but people in the armed forces surely have to accept that the possibility of grievous injury or death goes with the territory. At least the islanders are truly grateful which is more than can be said for some countries we helped in WW2.
Rarely do agree with Simon Jenkins, in the Guardian - but he wrote a piece on the Falklands back in February which is worth a read I think.
http://www.guardian.c...ns-expensive-nuisance
The issue surrounding FI is just the same as with Hong Kong and Gibralter. It is absurd to try hold on to these remnants of our colonialist past - such communities need more regional support than the UK can economically give.
http://www.guardian.c...ns-expensive-nuisance
The issue surrounding FI is just the same as with Hong Kong and Gibralter. It is absurd to try hold on to these remnants of our colonialist past - such communities need more regional support than the UK can economically give.
It's not a question of 'holding on to our colonialist past' it is a question of protecting the islanders from being taken over by a govt. with a brutal history - do you know how the islanders were treated during the occupation? If we can spend umpty-diddly billions protecting the Afghans from the taliban, saving the Africans from drought and Aids then surely we can spend on protecting our own.
To all those agreeing that we let Argentina have the Falklands back, I ask this:
If you lived on the Islands wouldn't you like a say on who should rule you, instead of some defeatists thousands of miles away, sitting in front of their computers bleating that we should desert you in your hour of need.
If you lived on the Islands wouldn't you like a say on who should rule you, instead of some defeatists thousands of miles away, sitting in front of their computers bleating that we should desert you in your hour of need.
Its worth remembering that in 1982 Galtieri was running a highly unpopular junta and was keen to boost public support. In Britain Thatcher was running an increasingly unpopular government and was keen to gain public support as well as reinforce her “Iron Lady” credentials, many political commentators have speculated as to how the election that year would have gone if not for the conflict.
Nowadays the Falkland’s/Malvinas are the key to our claim to the, apparently, vast riches that are now accessible in the ante-arctic and should we relinquish them we would lose our claim.
The conflict, which was not provoked or sought by Britain, resulted in a huge operation and loss of British service personnel. In the years since Argentina have not apologised as a nation, nor attempted to enter into any serious form of arbitration. The people on the islands are British and wish to remain so.
If France laid claim to Jersey, would we roll over and capitulate? War is a terrible thing but as with any bully if you run away you just invite more trouble.
Nowadays the Falkland’s/Malvinas are the key to our claim to the, apparently, vast riches that are now accessible in the ante-arctic and should we relinquish them we would lose our claim.
The conflict, which was not provoked or sought by Britain, resulted in a huge operation and loss of British service personnel. In the years since Argentina have not apologised as a nation, nor attempted to enter into any serious form of arbitration. The people on the islands are British and wish to remain so.
If France laid claim to Jersey, would we roll over and capitulate? War is a terrible thing but as with any bully if you run away you just invite more trouble.
People hate to be reminded of the facts, the fact that the U.S did not support our plans to retake the islands, the fact that it was only north sea oil that prevented another Suez Crisis (Yanks sold us out then too), they don't like to be reminded of the Chicago School Of Econonmics and the misery it heaped upon the developing world.
The change in the Americas since they stayed away from the I.M.F, people being lifted out of poverty, funny how Bush supported a coup against Chavez all the same.
The B.R.I.C.s have just negotiated a better say in global economy, Venezuela's trading oil in roubles, interesting times if the world decouples from the dollar, I digress.
The change in the Americas since they stayed away from the I.M.F, people being lifted out of poverty, funny how Bush supported a coup against Chavez all the same.
The B.R.I.C.s have just negotiated a better say in global economy, Venezuela's trading oil in roubles, interesting times if the world decouples from the dollar, I digress.
Guys, i'm sorry to correct you on the Yank bashing (you have no idea how truly sorry I am, having a go at our lost colonials is one of my favourite hobbies), but, we would never have regained the Falklands in 1981 without their assistance.
The four main things the Americans did were
1) AIM-9L Sidewinder missiles. They gave us a lot of these for our Harriers and rushed testing through so we would be able to use them
2) Access to Imagery and Communications satellites
3) Intelligence support from CIA to UK Military and FCO
4) Fuel and maintainance on Acension Islands
The reason this was not made public at the time was because of party politics being played out in the States with Bush's opponents being pro-Argentina and anti-NATO.
As for the statements about handing them back...what right do the Argentinians have over the Islands? France has more of a claim to them than the Argies. The residents do not want to fall under Argentian rule, and much prefer to remain as part of 'us'. Surely their wishes take primacy over anyone else? Same for Gib, and the same for the Channel Islands, Ilse Of Man, Ilse of White and Canvey Island!
The four main things the Americans did were
1) AIM-9L Sidewinder missiles. They gave us a lot of these for our Harriers and rushed testing through so we would be able to use them
2) Access to Imagery and Communications satellites
3) Intelligence support from CIA to UK Military and FCO
4) Fuel and maintainance on Acension Islands
The reason this was not made public at the time was because of party politics being played out in the States with Bush's opponents being pro-Argentina and anti-NATO.
As for the statements about handing them back...what right do the Argentinians have over the Islands? France has more of a claim to them than the Argies. The residents do not want to fall under Argentian rule, and much prefer to remain as part of 'us'. Surely their wishes take primacy over anyone else? Same for Gib, and the same for the Channel Islands, Ilse Of Man, Ilse of White and Canvey Island!
Do'h, your right it was Reagan (I feel like a bit of a fool now). Dunno why I was thinking of Bush (Freud would have a field day lol)
A lot of pressure was applied by the US Government to negotiate, but the White House and US Military was very pro-UK. Whether that was because of the Cold War and the need to have us supporting the Americans, or the close friendship between REAGAN (not Bush!) and Thatcher is something the historians will ponder.
However, were we right to go to war in 1981? Yes, undoubtedly
Would Argentina try it on again? I dunno, possibly if their nation goes further down the khazi (but I can't see it happening)
Would they suceed? Not a chance. In 1981 there was a single platoon of Royal Marines based on the island, along with an antiquated patrol vessel, and occasional visits by larger vessels. Now we have thousands of UK troops down there with a highly sophisticated air defence network, fighters on alert at all times, and the islanders also have a (very well trained and equipped) defence force.
A lot of pressure was applied by the US Government to negotiate, but the White House and US Military was very pro-UK. Whether that was because of the Cold War and the need to have us supporting the Americans, or the close friendship between REAGAN (not Bush!) and Thatcher is something the historians will ponder.
However, were we right to go to war in 1981? Yes, undoubtedly
Would Argentina try it on again? I dunno, possibly if their nation goes further down the khazi (but I can't see it happening)
Would they suceed? Not a chance. In 1981 there was a single platoon of Royal Marines based on the island, along with an antiquated patrol vessel, and occasional visits by larger vessels. Now we have thousands of UK troops down there with a highly sophisticated air defence network, fighters on alert at all times, and the islanders also have a (very well trained and equipped) defence force.
Dave, aye they did. Acension is a British Island which we leased to the Americans (like Diego Garcia). In 1981 the USAF gave virtually the entire bases fuel store to the RAF and also allocated almost all their 'war supplies' to us (things like food, ammo, medical supplies etc). This enable us to launch raids on the islands (Op Black Buck etc) as well as launching air-to-air refuelling and maritime patrol flights. It also allowed us to have somewhere for the transport aircraft that were bringing in supplies, to land, offload and transfer cargo onto the waiting ships.
123Everton I think Tory MP Andrew Rosi(n)dell represents the F.Is. at Westminster.
anotheoldgit -my sentiments exactly.
bobjugs 12 - spot on. I was living in the US at the time of the invasion and the Americans were quietly supportive of Britain's stance and helped us considerably. The local newspaper office used to deliver copies of all the Reuter's news with my evening paper as they knew I had lived and worked there and still had friends on the islands.
anotheoldgit -my sentiments exactly.
bobjugs 12 - spot on. I was living in the US at the time of the invasion and the Americans were quietly supportive of Britain's stance and helped us considerably. The local newspaper office used to deliver copies of all the Reuter's news with my evening paper as they knew I had lived and worked there and still had friends on the islands.
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