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Cenotaph.
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In 1919 at the first Cenotaph parade China was represented as it was an Allied power who had troops in France, I think they lost about 35 men 12 of whom we shot (for theft), in WW2 China was again an Allied power, so why weren't they at The Cenotaph laying a reef?
Surely when you consider the likes of Portugal, an Allied power in WW1 but neutral in WW2 has a right to be there also.
To sum up the question, shouldn't every nation with whom we currently have diplomatic relations be allowed to lay a reef at The Cenotaph?
Before someone chimes "what about the Germans?!!", where would we have been without Gebhardt Von Blucher and his Prussian Guards in Waterloo?
To me the act of rememberance is for the dead and dying of all wars and all future wars, to remind us of the injustice of war to humanity with nations now friends, and soldiers still dead.
Surely when you consider the likes of Portugal, an Allied power in WW1 but neutral in WW2 has a right to be there also.
To sum up the question, shouldn't every nation with whom we currently have diplomatic relations be allowed to lay a reef at The Cenotaph?
Before someone chimes "what about the Germans?!!", where would we have been without Gebhardt Von Blucher and his Prussian Guards in Waterloo?
To me the act of rememberance is for the dead and dying of all wars and all future wars, to remind us of the injustice of war to humanity with nations now friends, and soldiers still dead.
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here's the list from Wikipedia - but it doesn't mention other nations, except for Commonwealth ones, at all
wreaths are laid by the Queen and senior members of the Royal Family attending in military uniform and then, to "Beethoven's Funeral March" (composed by Johann Heinrich Walch), attendees in the following order: the Prime Minister; the leaders of the major political parties from all parts of the United Kingdom; Commonwealth High Commissioners to London, on behalf of their respective nations; the Foreign Secretary, on behalf of the British Dependencies; the First Sea Lord; the Chief of the General Staff; the Chief of the Air Staff; representatives of the merchant navy and Fishing Fleets and the merchant air service.
So perhaps it's a purely local (and Commonwealth) thing.
I think Britain did join in the intervention of Russia in 1918, didn't it? But it didn't get support from the public, who'd had enough of war.
wreaths are laid by the Queen and senior members of the Royal Family attending in military uniform and then, to "Beethoven's Funeral March" (composed by Johann Heinrich Walch), attendees in the following order: the Prime Minister; the leaders of the major political parties from all parts of the United Kingdom; Commonwealth High Commissioners to London, on behalf of their respective nations; the Foreign Secretary, on behalf of the British Dependencies; the First Sea Lord; the Chief of the General Staff; the Chief of the Air Staff; representatives of the merchant navy and Fishing Fleets and the merchant air service.
So perhaps it's a purely local (and Commonwealth) thing.
I think Britain did join in the intervention of Russia in 1918, didn't it? But it didn't get support from the public, who'd had enough of war.
We did have troops there, Albert Steptoe for one lol, but I wasn't sure if it was like a private enterprise.
A bit like in Rhodesia 1978.
Either way, you'd think our joint enterprise from 1941 to 1945 would countenance the 1919 blip.
I'm just thinking that the act of rememberance is perhaps poorer for the absence of other nations, even ones we dislike currently.
Singapore was there, but Malaysia wasn't (although Malaysia doesn't commemorate it locally), one could argue that Singapore was representing Malaysia by being there (sort of), so, you could perhaps argue that at least Taiwan should be there to represent the K.M.T (Republic Of China) who maybe technically participated in WW2 instead of the P.R.C.
Of course the diplomats may pull a face, sod em!
This is a day to celebrate peace, and commemorate loss, can we not all just bury the hatchet for one day?
A bit like in Rhodesia 1978.
Either way, you'd think our joint enterprise from 1941 to 1945 would countenance the 1919 blip.
I'm just thinking that the act of rememberance is perhaps poorer for the absence of other nations, even ones we dislike currently.
Singapore was there, but Malaysia wasn't (although Malaysia doesn't commemorate it locally), one could argue that Singapore was representing Malaysia by being there (sort of), so, you could perhaps argue that at least Taiwan should be there to represent the K.M.T (Republic Of China) who maybe technically participated in WW2 instead of the P.R.C.
Of course the diplomats may pull a face, sod em!
This is a day to celebrate peace, and commemorate loss, can we not all just bury the hatchet for one day?
it sounds as if it's simply not thought of as an open gathering but as a family affair - those fighting for the queen/king. Perhaps it was different in its earliest years?
I'm not sure about the Russian civil war - I'd always thought British policy was official, with Churchill saying something about strangling the revolution in its cradle. I could be wrong there.
I'm not sure about the Russian civil war - I'd always thought British policy was official, with Churchill saying something about strangling the revolution in its cradle. I could be wrong there.
I've never really studided it, done the Russo Polish War a little bit but that was different.
I think you're right, it's for those who fought for us rather than with us, at least nowadays anyway.
Pity, you'd think the act of rememberance would mean more now, and compel us to think of the consequences of war, before they're fought.
I think you're right, it's for those who fought for us rather than with us, at least nowadays anyway.
Pity, you'd think the act of rememberance would mean more now, and compel us to think of the consequences of war, before they're fought.
The parade in 1919 (19th July) was Peace Day and included representation from all Allied troops. A cenotaph for this event was hastily manufactured of wood and plaster.
A permanent cenotaph was constructed in 1920. The unveiling of the stone structure by King George V on 11th November 1920 was combined with a ceremony to mark the passing of the body of the Unknown Warrior for re-burial at Westminster Abbey.
The first annual ceremony took place at the Cenotaph on the same date the following year. Since that time, the Cenotaph and the ceremony held there on Remembrance Sunday has been the national focus for commemorating the British and Commonwealth war dead.
A permanent cenotaph was constructed in 1920. The unveiling of the stone structure by King George V on 11th November 1920 was combined with a ceremony to mark the passing of the body of the Unknown Warrior for re-burial at Westminster Abbey.
The first annual ceremony took place at the Cenotaph on the same date the following year. Since that time, the Cenotaph and the ceremony held there on Remembrance Sunday has been the national focus for commemorating the British and Commonwealth war dead.
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