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Making the Law more Accessible
I’ve just had a long conversation with a colleague, and both of us feel that the law is not accessible to “the man in the street”. This got us to thinking about how we could make it more accessible.
I’m interested in people’s views. For example, there are sites such as this where people ask questions – sometimes they get a definitive answer which is great (hey, free advice is fantastic!). Sometimes their cases are a little too complicated for anything other than a general view and very often the advice is “See a solicitor”. There are other general information websites out there, which give lots of information, but it is not “case specific”.
I think it comes down to “cost”. If you look at the traditional lawyer’s firm, they have considerable overheads. Consequently, the hourly rate has to cover all those overheads and make a profit.
Now increasing Legal Aid isn't an option (it's going to be cut further in time), so isn't it up to the legal profession to make sure that legal advice is not just the prerogative of the rich?
So how do we reduce these costs? Well once answer is a “virtual law” service – ie online – using skype and telephones when necessary. However, what occurred to us is that this would not necessarily work because of a perceived lack of credibility.
I’m probably opening a massive can of worms here, but I’m interested to hear how people feel that getting the right advice could become more accessible.
I’m interested in people’s views. For example, there are sites such as this where people ask questions – sometimes they get a definitive answer which is great (hey, free advice is fantastic!). Sometimes their cases are a little too complicated for anything other than a general view and very often the advice is “See a solicitor”. There are other general information websites out there, which give lots of information, but it is not “case specific”.
I think it comes down to “cost”. If you look at the traditional lawyer’s firm, they have considerable overheads. Consequently, the hourly rate has to cover all those overheads and make a profit.
Now increasing Legal Aid isn't an option (it's going to be cut further in time), so isn't it up to the legal profession to make sure that legal advice is not just the prerogative of the rich?
So how do we reduce these costs? Well once answer is a “virtual law” service – ie online – using skype and telephones when necessary. However, what occurred to us is that this would not necessarily work because of a perceived lack of credibility.
I’m probably opening a massive can of worms here, but I’m interested to hear how people feel that getting the right advice could become more accessible.
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How is it accessible KerrAvon,.let alone more, to the man in the street?
Do you mean there are ambulance- chasing claims farmers, who advertise on TV ? They are accessible enough!. Or do you mean that the law is readable online,on open sites? Well,it is, in that statutes are there,and some cases, but you have to know where to look , what you are looking for, and how to interpret what you read.Or the very basic summaries you find on some firms' sites?Of necessity, these can only give the very simple information that, in other times, you'd find in Everyman's Home Lawyer.
Do you mean there are ambulance- chasing claims farmers, who advertise on TV ? They are accessible enough!. Or do you mean that the law is readable online,on open sites? Well,it is, in that statutes are there,and some cases, but you have to know where to look , what you are looking for, and how to interpret what you read.Or the very basic summaries you find on some firms' sites?Of necessity, these can only give the very simple information that, in other times, you'd find in Everyman's Home Lawyer.
well I think KerrAvon has something of a point. I can well imagine my parents (born in 1919 Dad working class, Mum white collar working class) thinking (and saying) that solicitors "aren't for the likes of us" They never bought houses or made wills.
When my Fil was a steward and the club was robbed after hours, he was tied up with parcel tape. The police tried to get him to admit that he was involved and attempted to plant stolen cheque books on him. He and mil were in a total state and it took my DH going down there telling the police that he would sort out a solicitor for my fil that got it sorted.
I wont say that people of their generation were exactly afraid of the law but there was a kind of ignorance of the facts, a bit the same as having blind faith in the good old family doctor and having the kids curtsey when he visited.
I think its quite hard for the younger among us to realise what life was like before the internet and especially before the net book agreement crumbled. Books cost money, the main source of information was the public library and the information in there was probably sketchy and outdated.
Websites that actually tell people stuff like what happens in court, how a will is probated and executed, what your rights are in respect of neighbours hedges, sick pay, choosing a school for you child and so on have made a huge difference in people's lives.
When my Fil was a steward and the club was robbed after hours, he was tied up with parcel tape. The police tried to get him to admit that he was involved and attempted to plant stolen cheque books on him. He and mil were in a total state and it took my DH going down there telling the police that he would sort out a solicitor for my fil that got it sorted.
I wont say that people of their generation were exactly afraid of the law but there was a kind of ignorance of the facts, a bit the same as having blind faith in the good old family doctor and having the kids curtsey when he visited.
I think its quite hard for the younger among us to realise what life was like before the internet and especially before the net book agreement crumbled. Books cost money, the main source of information was the public library and the information in there was probably sketchy and outdated.
Websites that actually tell people stuff like what happens in court, how a will is probated and executed, what your rights are in respect of neighbours hedges, sick pay, choosing a school for you child and so on have made a huge difference in people's lives.
yes partially the no win no fee mob do make the law more available but I was also referring to the excellent small claims process that i have used several times for ultimately no cost. Legal aid is also pretty useful and I have benefited from that too. Perhaps you could give some examples of what is meant by the non availability of law for "the man in the street" because in my experience I have found the current climate very good.
I think certain areas have ben made far more accessible, obviously the personal injury claims etc... but residential conveyancing has made a lot of use of advancing technology with email being used a lot, case management systems, online searches, Land Registry online, moves to e-conveyancing etc... It has speeded things up no end with so much being able to be done by email.
Similarly you have Money Claims online, Possession Claims online etc... making those kind of claims much simpler, especially for people to do themselves, especially for simpler claims, rather than going through a solicitor.
I understand there are a lot of online will services too and things like divorce can be done via online companies.
I'm surprised the advent of "Tesco Law" hasn't been more established already, where people can go in for simple general queries for cheaper fees etc...
I think that when Alternative Business Structures are more established then that could open the market up, just so long as it retains it's professional standards and regulation. I'd quite glad to see referral fees banned too and the moves to regulate the PI industry and certain money claims with structured set costs for legal representatives.
I think (hope anyway!) that the image of the old fashioned lawyer is diminishing - I've worked in a fair few law firms and been in many others though moreso being in the city.
I think commercial law is a bit different as many commercial lawyers form part of a business team so meetings are part of that, it's a different thing entirely really. I believe insurance based contracts are aroud for things like employment law so clients can pay installments to be on an insurance scheme for advice to a certain level.
I've done general and commercial work and a lot of my advice was done on the phone or electronically, I would do electronically as much as I could as it makes things far quicker and more efficient, especially now a lot of people can access email via their phones.
In one firm I worked at we ran a legal surgery I used to do a number of times a week. We used to get all kinds of issues though, quite a few of them not really legal ones.
I think it is hard to give virtual "quick fix" advice to any professional level virtually unless the relevant safeguards and such are in place and often you need quite a lot more information than is initially presented to be able to advise properly and more succintly without having to give all kinds of different possibilities if not straightforward. There are also regulatory issues such as proper instruction, ID requirements, compliance, letters of instruction including regulatory issues like complaints procedure etc...
To a certain extent I believe that, depending on the issue, you do get what you pay for.
Similarly you have Money Claims online, Possession Claims online etc... making those kind of claims much simpler, especially for people to do themselves, especially for simpler claims, rather than going through a solicitor.
I understand there are a lot of online will services too and things like divorce can be done via online companies.
I'm surprised the advent of "Tesco Law" hasn't been more established already, where people can go in for simple general queries for cheaper fees etc...
I think that when Alternative Business Structures are more established then that could open the market up, just so long as it retains it's professional standards and regulation. I'd quite glad to see referral fees banned too and the moves to regulate the PI industry and certain money claims with structured set costs for legal representatives.
I think (hope anyway!) that the image of the old fashioned lawyer is diminishing - I've worked in a fair few law firms and been in many others though moreso being in the city.
I think commercial law is a bit different as many commercial lawyers form part of a business team so meetings are part of that, it's a different thing entirely really. I believe insurance based contracts are aroud for things like employment law so clients can pay installments to be on an insurance scheme for advice to a certain level.
I've done general and commercial work and a lot of my advice was done on the phone or electronically, I would do electronically as much as I could as it makes things far quicker and more efficient, especially now a lot of people can access email via their phones.
In one firm I worked at we ran a legal surgery I used to do a number of times a week. We used to get all kinds of issues though, quite a few of them not really legal ones.
I think it is hard to give virtual "quick fix" advice to any professional level virtually unless the relevant safeguards and such are in place and often you need quite a lot more information than is initially presented to be able to advise properly and more succintly without having to give all kinds of different possibilities if not straightforward. There are also regulatory issues such as proper instruction, ID requirements, compliance, letters of instruction including regulatory issues like complaints procedure etc...
To a certain extent I believe that, depending on the issue, you do get what you pay for.
Interesting points, Kerr. You mention Legal Aid, which started in 1949. It, of course, for the provision of lawyers for defendants and litigants.It has been greatly decreased in scope in recent years, in particular in not now being available in personal injury cases (which explains the emergence of claims farmers on TV). It is also now poorly paid work for lawyers in criminal cases, to the extent that many practices no longer do it,and those that still do are barely rewarded for spending time on cases.This all suggests that lawyers are becoming less accessible to the ordinary person and/or they are less well served by the lawyers when the lawyers are accessible.
The staff in the High Court and County courts, which include small claims, have always been very helpful to the layman, so there's nothing new there.
You may wonder why Barmaid and her colleague, both practitioners at the Bar,should ever think that the law is not accessible, or needs to be more accessible, if what you say is fundamentally correct.
The staff in the High Court and County courts, which include small claims, have always been very helpful to the layman, so there's nothing new there.
You may wonder why Barmaid and her colleague, both practitioners at the Bar,should ever think that the law is not accessible, or needs to be more accessible, if what you say is fundamentally correct.
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