The Truest Thing Ever Said By A Politician?

[Colmc54]

Jacques Santer said that economic union in the EU would not work without political union/integration. How right he was when you look at the Eurozone now.
Can anyone think of another example of a politician who had the guts to say the truth but was ignored or even derided for doing so.

[jake-the-peg]

And we have pretty good political integration

Council of ministers from each country

Elected MEPs from each country

The result is that from places like the US Europe is seen as an entity, you can travel from one country to another without mounds of paperwork - I don't have to go through weeks of visa applications for a business trip to Europe like I do to some countries.
I can work in any European country, move goods around no problem

There are European arrest warrants which mean Ronnie Biggs and his like can no longer laugh at us from the costa-del-crime

The one area we need to work on is motoring law

It's ridiculous that the UK can't ban a German from driving or vice versa that UK speeders in France can't get points - don't you think?

[Peter Pedant]

Head of the Fed in 1929 saying the depression was here to stay
didnt remain head v long

Churchill in wilderness years ?

some would say definitely Enoch Powell (not during the time he was minister of Health 1962-3 )

edward grey 1914 - the lights are going out all over europe
or was it - roll up those maps they will not be needed for 20 y ?


stone wall Jackson's last words - who are those people shooting at ?

[jake-the-peg]

Hmm - watch out for Churchill Peter (I note your wise question mark)

He wrote 'the Gathering Storm' and rather painted a rosy picture of himself which has been perpetuated by the fan-boys ever since.

Far from being a lone voice against German re-armament Lloyd -George preceded him in that regard

You also rarely hear repeated his quote: "I will not pretend that, if I had to choose between communism and Nazism, I would choose communism"

or his 'hope that Hitler, if he so chose, and despite his rise to power through dictatorial action, hatred and cruelty, might yet "go down in history as the man who restored honour and peace of mind to the great Germanic nation'

Unfortunately too many view him through black and white war films and the generation that would have cheerfully throttled him is now all but gone

[jno]

that'd be the generation who voted him back in again, jake

[Colmc54]

I think he was talking about how important it was that the convergence criteria pre- the EURO were not fudged, which they were, and that the Growth and Stability Package, similarly fudged or simply ignored, had to be adhered to if the Eurozone project was to be a success.

Now we see the Eurozone divided between the North and the South, unemployment sky high, especially youth unemployment...

I was thinking about Santer because I was wondering if the same thing could happen to the pound if we end up with it being shared with an independent Scotland.
Two governments both locked in competition with each other, one of which has slashed it's rate of corporation tax by 3%, but both still sharing the same currency! I think Santer should be giving us a similar warning right now.

[FredPuli43]

PP, "The lights are going out all over Europe. We shall not see them lit again in our lifetime" a remark of Grey, overheard by a colleague, when Grey saw a lamplighter lighting the gas lamps below their window. Time? The eve of the Great War.

"Roll up that map. It will not be wanted these ten years" Pitt the Younger, on hearing the news of Napoleon's victory at Austerlitz . Spot on ! Austerlitz was in 1805. Waterloo was ten years later.

[Peter Pedant]

Thanks Fred
I blame my history master

have a good New Year - are you feeling any better ? PP

[FredPuli43]

And you PP, have a good year. Yes, my jaundice has gone.I feel much better.

And a happy New Year, to all ABers !

[Colmc54]

I thought Powell would turn up. I liked Pitt the younger. I considered Churchill's speech in the US when he warned of the genesis of the Iron Curtain. I even thought about John major's comment that Scottish devolution would bring about the end of the UK.

My best answer will go to the politician who told the truth, but also was derided and ridiculed for his trouble, and was then shown to have been right all along.

[FredPuli43]

Welcome to AB, Colmc54 .

This requires some thought. There are plenty of politicians who have been proved right, but finding one who was seriously derided by reasonable commentators as well is a little harder.

[FredPuli43]

I suggest Lloyd George's statement that "A fully-equipped Duke costs as much to keep up as two Dreadnoughts, and Dukes are just as great a terror and they last longer". I bet that went down well with the many conservative folk who thought Dukes , and the House of Lords, were fine as they were ! And many of those opposed to reform would have been wise, intelligent people. (This was two years before the Parliament Act, and a long time before the latest reforms).

[Colmc54]

Is there anything, if we can forget the present eternal party-political acrimony, that can show that there once was a politician who spoke the truth? If he did what price did he pay? What was his fate?

[woofgang]

Glad to hear you are better fred.

[FredPuli43]

In Britain, Colmc, the politician who tells the truth is ignored. He doesn't suffer because he's told the truth; that's because his opponents are convinced that they are telling the truth themselves.

And in the instant case, who says that Santer was telling the truth ? By 'telling the truth' you mean only that you think it was the truth, don't you? What evidence do you produce to prove that Santer's opinion is factually correct?

[sandyRoe]

'It doesn't matter whether a cat is black or white, as long as it catches mice...'
Deng Xiaoping.

[Colmc54]

Fred, happy New Year.
I think Santer told the truth and paid the price. The last thing politicians want is anything that puts obstacles in the way of their ability to bribe their hapless electorates with vote-winning policies, however detached from the real world they are.

In WW2 there were Nazi generals who had the courage to tell Hitler he needed to retreat from Stalingrad, and were proved to have been tactically spot on when their advice was ignored.

In science Galileo is the best example but Wegener with his promotion of continental drift now known as plate tectonics was treated harshly by his opponents, as was Darwin.

The previous UK government presided over a boom in the economy that was fueled by easy credit based on a superstition that the value of real estate could never fall.

Watching News Night back then I know there were many economists warning that the credit crunch was coming. In the ranks of the politicians it appears that only one man was prepared to carry their warnings into parliament. History will show his warnings were treated with contempt and ridicule but tragically for the UK his warnings were proved all to prophetic.

Vince Cable is now a cabinet minister in the coalition government. He is still something of a loose cannon but as someone whose retirement plans were destroyed because no one listened to him such that I will probably now have to work till I die, I hope his example is followed by others who will hopefully be listened to and taken seriously when they warn us of our folly.

The intelligentsia of the UK left currently have their guns pointed at the leader of UKIP...

[Colmc54]

Edwina Curry and her warning about Salmonella in eggs?