The British And Property Ownership

[Khandro]

Do you think the British, and the English in particular, are inordinately attached to owning property, and is the belief among the young that they must at any cost get on the 'property ladder', leading them into the burden of debt and unfortunate circumstances?

[woofgang]

some, at least of the bourneville cottages were sold to workers
"Houses should cost at least £150 to build: they were to house 'honest, sober, thrifty workmen, rather than the destitute or very poor'. Building was restricted on each plot to prevent gardens being overshadowed and keep the rural feel. The first houses were sold on leases of 999 years to keep the rural appearance of the district: mortgages were available for would-be purchasers."

I am not sure how renting accommodation for life would work. What did they do when the residents retired and the incoming employees needed housing? You can't just keep building more.

Its my understanding that the growth of council housing was to deal with the situation post WW2 when much of the housing stock was destroyed?

[Peter Pedant]

// If Ctenants have 2+ holidays pa, eyebrows are raised, //

yeah the Landlords go potty esp if they are in arrears,
and when asked for rent say - well I just dont have it

[Zacs-Master]

Khandro, nothing to say about my link which proves that it's not just the English who are 'inordinately attached' to owning property? Or the fact that university debts have a lot to answer for?

Personally I'm looking forward to having my mortgage paid off in 6 years, downsizing, and having a nice little nest egg.

[tamborine]

Pp...no rent = eviction.

if we all lived EU lifestyle of rentals then rents would balance likewise. Like me most germans rented, only farmers owned property in 60s. Seemed like communism when owning property was prohibitive?

[whiskeryron]

Zacs, Let us hope that you will never be in the position of having to go into a care home when believe me under the in-equel system your lovely saved nest egg could be taken from you in order to pay for your accommodation.

[Khandro]

Perhaps I'm sliding into becoming a communist in my dotage :0) but the injudicious selling of council properties was reprehensible. Proudhon famously said "Property is theft" and for Marx, the invention of private property was akin to original sin! Councils in one sense didn't actually own the land or properties, it belonged to everyone, and they managed it, so it wasn't strictly speaking theirs to sell.
The rising cost of housing in the UK has led to the iniquitous "buy to rent" phenomenon, allowing greed to worsen the lot of the already poor and through housing benefit put a greater strain on the taxpayer.
I'm no fan of the present Labour Party, but as they seem to be searching for ideas, maybe a commitment to the building of more high quality community housing would have resonance with the electorate?

[Zacs-Master]

Still no comment I see.

[jomifl]

/the injudicious selling of council properties was reprehensible/
My parents who had been council tenants since WW2 were allowed to buy there house from the council.(If they had been able to obtain a mortgage they would have owned their house decades earlier)
as a result they didn't have to pay rent in their retirement and so result had an old age free of financial worries(at least in theory since they really couldn't get used to not having to worry). Not a bad outcome for a tory exploiter of the working classes.

[Old_Geezer]

A Tory exploiter of low income voters who welcomed the bribe to help them in their old age.

[Khandro]

jomifl; I pleased that your parents had a happy retirement, - mine too, though they never actually owned the property - but it doesn't alter the fact that they were sold something by someone to whom it didn't really belong, originally the property being built and paid for by public money, and now the property is no longer available as a public asset .

[Zacs-Master]

No but the liquid asset would, at some point, have been spent on goods or services, so aiding the economy and thereby benefitting same.

[jomifl]

Khandro, My parents had already paid for their ex council house in rent several times over. The real issue is that the tories wouldn't let councils use the revenue to build more council houses. Where I worked many of the well paid and in my opinion feckless workers lived in council houses and deprived seriously disadvantaged people of the ability to rent those houses when they could easily afford to buy a house and lived the life of riley with expensive holidays, cars etc. Of course in their old age things will be different.

[Khandro]

jomifl;// The real issue is that the tories wouldn't let councils use the revenue to build more council houses.//
No, maybe I'm not making myself clear, the real issue was not that they had paid the cost of the building, and don't forget maintaining, the property, but of irrevocably changing it, and the land it stands on, from public to private ownership.
Your opinion as to whether or not some of the occupants of council properties are feckless is, with respect, irrelevant.

[jomifl]

Khandro, /the real issue was not that they had paid the cost of the building, and don't forget maintaining, the property, but of irrevocably changing it, and the land it stands on, from public to private ownership/
That is another issue.
My point about the feckless tenants is that if they had taken the trouble to buy a hous or at least rent it in the private sector it would have freed up a lot of housing for the really needy. As it was I knew guys who had the same pay, some in council housing and others buying their own houses. The house buyers just didn't have the same overt wealth as the council tenants. It used to be a given that it was always possible to identify a council estate by the abundance of satellite dishes.

[Khandro]

jomifl; You still seem to be missing my point by espousing the view that the ultimate objective in domestic life is the attainment of property ownership. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with wealth, owning property can be such a burden and life restricting, removing the flexibility of renters. My brother in law for example was a director of Germany's largest bank and has lived his entire life in rented accommodation.
You say; //The house buyers just didn't have the same overt wealth as the council tenants.//
My point exactly.

[jomifl]

My point was that owning property works out less expensive in the long run and gives you choices. My sister lived in council accommodation and was unable to move to a house less crappy than the one she was in because the houses available were worse. If I need to go into a care home when I am more ancient I can pay for it by selling my house. If there is anything left whhen I die it will go towards the education of friends' children. I expect your brother can afford rented accommodation. Council accommodation is a trap that should be avoided.