For blackcat

[lankeela]

Details of the lady who does the hip scoring without anaesthetic:

Marilyn Baker
Wanitopa, Lordswood, Highbridge, Eastleigh, Hants SO50 6HR. Tel.
01329 230052.

She can be difficult to get hold of but keep trying, it took my friend the best
part of 2 weeks to actually get hold of her on the phone to make an
appointment but once she did the appointment was very quick and on a
Sunday too!

She charges �85.40 for the hips for the x-ray of which �34.50 is
for the BVA fees.

[blackcat77]

That's great - thanks very much for your help Lankeela - I'll contact her after Christmas.

[Noweia]

How on earth does she manage it without anaesthesia?! She should do courses around the country and save us vets a fortune in anaesthetic costs!

[blackcat77]

Lankeela or Norweia would you explain what it involves?
I know that it is the sum of both hips, is it done with one x-ray or several and does the vet score them or do they go to the BVA to be scored?

[lankeela]

If they don't use anaesthetic, they use sedation, but some people don't like that because if anything goes wrong, it takes longer to bring them round from the sedation, whereas the anaesthetics they use these days are quickly reversible. Unless the dog is very laid back, even with sedation it is difficult to make the dog keep still enough.

They x-ray both hips, and the plates are sent off to the BVA for scoring, although most vets will give you some idea whether they are either good or not so good. I had a bitch done who was in season, and I planned on mating her. Her plates showed that her hip joints were so worn that they did not fit in the sockets and arthritis had started to set in. This bitch did agility and you would never have known she had a problem, but she had been in a pet home for her first two years and even though both parents had low scores and the rest of the litter were ok, her score was 76.
Suffice to say she was not bred from!

The lowest score is 0 - 0 and the highest 53 - 53. It is better if the scores are fairly even, although an odd score such as 2 - 40 would indicate a trauma or injury rather than
poorly formed hips. The breed mean score (average score from the total number of dogs of that breed scored)
gives you an idea of what is good for your particular breed, but obviously the more dogs scored the better idea you will get. This is why it is important for all plates to be sent away for scoring, even if the vet says they are not very good.
All results are published in the Kennel Club Breed Records Supplement. In the latest issue there are seven Malinois listed and the lowest is 0 - 0 and the highest 3 -4, with others in between.

[blackcat77]

Thank you Lankeela for the explanation - so which do you think would be better for Isla - sedation or anaesthetic -bearing in mind that she is not the most laid back dog in the world? I haven't asked my own vet about this yet as they seem pretty expensive for whatever they want to do!

[lankeela]

The Breed Mean Score for Malinois as at the end of 2007 was 9 - there had been 125 dogs scored, with scores ranging from 0 - 60.

http://www.bva.co.uk/public/documents/Breed_Me an_Scores_-2008.pdf

Noweia, why not ring Marilyn and ask about her doing a seminar for other vets? I know people who travel hundreds of miles just to have her do their dogs.

[lankeela]

I'd have a word with her and see what she says. She will know how quiet they need to be, and as she is in your area anyway, you have got the advantage that you wouldn't have to travel far and then find out you can't use the sedation method.

[blackcat77]

Yes, I'll do that. Thanks very much for all your help Lankeela.

[woofgang]

are you hipscoring for a reason, ie do you want to breed soon or does the breeder want the litter scored?

[blackcat77]

Hi Woofgang - I will have her hip-scored because the breeder and I both feel that it is a good idea and also although we do not have any plans to breed from her at present, I may want to in the future.

[Noweia]

It's difficult to do a hip score on a conscious dog, even a really calm one, because they have to be on their back, with their legs tied together and pulled right back, until they are straight out behind the dog. Everything must be dead straight and in alignment - if it's out by even a little the BVA sends it back and tells us to do it again. Health and safety dictates that no-one can stay in the room and hold the dog or talk to it whilst the x-ray is being taken. Trying to even get an obedience champion to do that without restraint is challenging!

Therefore most of the time some form of chemical restraint is used - either sedation or anaesthesia. Our practice would usually use a deep sedation to x-ray the hips, unless there was a problem with the dogs heart, kidneys or liver, in which case we'd use an anaesthetic. The drug we use to get deep sedation is reversible, as is the anesthetic induction agent.

Only one x-ray is needed - a single shot of the pelvis from bottom to top.

If your dog is young and healthy, it would probably get the standard deep sedation of Dexdomitor in combination with a synergistic drug (unless your local practice has different protocols). I prefer using chemical restraint myself, over keeping the dog conscious, because it is just so much quicker and safer for us, and less stressful for the dog.

You can phone your local practice and ask what their general procedure is for hip scoring. The reason they are so expensive is to cover the cost of the BVA fee, the cost of the x-rays and the cost of the sedation or anaesthetic. Removing the need for chemical restraint would remove around �30-�60 off the bill - hence my interest in the idea!