Animals get more protection than humans

[Ahmed]

Why is there such a hoo haa with regards to hunting in this country? Back in my home country it was quite normal to go bear hunting on Sundays with the family, and yet over here you get lynched if you kick a dog.

[londondave]

Hmm Nice day out for the kids hurting wounding and killing animals for fun. Too right you should get lynched for kicking a dog.

If you are hunting for food, then fair enough as I am no veggie, but why bother when all the meat you can eat is available in supermarkets

[supaman]

what if they had pen like sections in supermarkets where u could hire a gun and shoot the animal you wanted then pay for him at the checkout. That means you get the fun of choosing, killing and skinning the animal yourself.

[supaman]

they could do the same in pet shops except you have to bid to save the animals and if you bid enough to make the reserve you get the animal ie. cat or dog and if you dont then it gets shot.

[Ahmed]

Not sure I agree with supaman. It just wouldn't be practical.

It does really annoy me that a lot of people think that animals have the same feelings as us and think in the same way. They don't. They are simple.

If a dog misbehaves, you give it a slap or a kick and it will no that it shouldn't do it again and risk another hit.

you certainly can't sit the dog down and tell it what's right or wrong.

[dan.ryan]

i went hunting in america and its the best thing i have ever done, i felt like a real man with my shotgun.

[New Forester]

Ahmed -

 

I think it's you who needs to be sat down and told what's right and wrong.  There are perhaps very rare occasions when a dog might need a tap on the nose -- but if you think slapping or kicking a dog does any good at all, it really only shows that you don't understand how a dog's mind works.   Dogs do need to know who's boss, but violence is completely unnecessary for that -- you are just bullying it, and this is more an indication of your own lack of self-control.  Bullying may make you feel powerful and strong, but it makes your soul small and sick.

 

I do agree that there is a great deal too much sentimentality about animals, and this can sometimes lead to cruelty -- as for example in the case of the horse's artificial leg recently discussed here, or the frequent over-intervention of the "Rolf Harris" type (setting hamsters' legs etc).

(cont...)

 

[New Forester]

(...cont)

To come back to your original question...  All species of bears throughout the world are now rare.  Why would you want to help wipe them out?  Again, this says more about you than about animal protection.



Moreover it is utterly ridiculous to suggest that "animals get more protection than humans".  All modern states put animals well below humans -- (indeed, if your bear-hunting was legal, a good bit too low).  For example, what would happen to you if you were caught kicking or slapping a child?



Personally I have no hesitation in killing an animal when necessary -- I'm a beef farmer, and only this morning I watched while one of my steers was slaughtered.  But it should be done for the right reason.  Pure enjoyment is the wrong reason -- an animal's life and comfort are more deserving of concern than my casual and self-indulgent pastimes -- I could always collect stamps instead.  If the activity is worthwhile on its own account, there's nothing wrong with enjoying it as well, but harming something for fun alone is not justified.

This, I think, is the real reason why organised hunting with dogs is outdated -- not because it's "cruel", but because it's barbaric to hurt something just for fun.  Galloping about the countryside is brilliant fun -- but why involve a fox?

[andy hughes]

Ahmed - you have to appreciate national attitudes in this issue, and in the UK, they divide neatly down the middle. On the one hand, you have town dwellers, they have pets. On the other side you have country dwellers, they have working animals, food animals, and vermin. the attitudes of each are poles apart, and each claims to misunderstood by the other. As i have said previously on this subject - hunters should admit that they hunt for pleasure, certainly their success statistics suggest that their favourite defence of keeping the fox population in check shows that they are woefully inefficient. Cruelty to animals is barbaric. I can't really see a valid argument against that statement.

[snuggles]

NewF....I could not have written a more inspired answer myself (not so patiently, anyway!) Well done you. Ahmed...you'd do well to not only read it, but heed it also.

[New Forester]

Andy -  I live in the country, where we do have working animals, food animals and vermin.  But we also have pets, and strange to tell we are not all barbarians.

 

I don't think the division is quite as neat as all that.

 

[Ahmed]

Fair point.

Which is more cruel, me giving a dog a well needed kick, or me stamping on an ant?

 

Surely mowing the lawn is cruel, but because it doesn't comminicate in a way we recognise, we don't care about it.

[Ray.Pist]

people kill rats and other pests but then we go and cage them and call them 'pets'.  i would love to know what dog tastes like, has anyone tried it?

[FP]

New Forester, You have said all I would like to say, but put it so much better than I could ever hope to. 

Violence is violence whether it be towards animals or humans.   It is the way of bullies and cowards. 

[Ahmed]

Fake plastic, what do you do if something or someone is violent to you?

[Ahmed]

Fake plastic, you specifically talk about violence towards animals and humans. What about grass, trees, priceless works of art, or even the police? 

[andy hughes]

New Forester - on reflection, I may have over-simplified my argument, and i take your point totally. I did not wish to infer that country dwellers have no compassion for animals, only that their attitude is coloured by the variety of animals they encounter - I am sure you would agree that their attitude to working / food / vermin animals is different to pets, that was the point I (clumsily) tried to make.

[FP]

Ahmed:  I would defend myself if someone was violent to me.  This doesn't mean I condone violence - it is a natural reaction to protect oneself.

 

I didn't realise that works of art have feelings.  I am not convinced that grass and trees feel pain, but I would not kick them for no reason.

 

I presume you have a grudge against the Police with your statement inferring they are not human.  I don't think we should go there.......

 

 

[RogerK]

I think I know what you meant, Andy but I'd just like to add my comments to New Forester's.I've always keep a mixture of working dogs and pet dogs plus the odd pet cat over the years. We've also got a competition horse and a 'pet' pony that just keeps the others company. Like New Forester I'm happy with the fact that meat is the consequence of a killing and feel comfortable in knowing how my meat was killed. It might seems strange to some but I have no problem with feeding the pheasants that come into my garden in the morning and shooting one in a field in the afternoon.

[Shadow]

Ahmed! Please just SHUT UP!! I admit to being a huge animal lover. I actually punched my friend real hard for killig a fly and threatned him if he did it again.

So don't come acros me and your lucky you won't!         Now remeber point no 1: Just because an animal is small you shouldn't just go squish it, what if an elephant went and squished you? You wouldn't like it but you couldn't complain, you'd be dead. Your family would be upset and that's sad. Some for animals. If their young died, they'd be so upset. Just because people think they have the upper hand don't mean they do.

Also notice point 2: A person if killed by a bear as he was about to kill him or her for his or her fur. The bear would be shot. A human kills a bear for no reason. They don't get killed. They don't want to be like that to a human. But they wouldn't care about the poor bears emotions or it's family.

Why don't animals have the same rights as humans, it's unfair. Plus animals are not simple and they do have fellings so don't be such a fool!

Answer this Ahmed:

would you go Bear Hunting and killed a bear for no reason or if you didn't and agreed that you shouldn't remeber what you are.

If you choose to hunt, then you are heartless with shame to hang on to your live dragging you down to the pitts of hell, while only if you didn't, then welcome to whatever religion you are, and get welcomed to the kingdom! If you believe this is ok to hunt, then that's you, but you wouldn't like an animal to kill one of your family members would you? Answer that oe aswell!