Crb Check And Change Of Identity

[fruitsalad]

Further to my first question about the CRB certificate, it got me thinking how the likes of The little Bulger boys, murderers, who have had a change of identity, would they get a clear record, surely not!

[rockyracoon]

Doesn't the form ask if you've been known by any other name?

[ummmm]

No...because it has to go through the police who will know their new identities.

[EDDIE51]

Crime committed as a child (under 16) is not recorded on a CRB check.
So Yes they will have a clean record if they have a check as adults.

[Islay]

Persons of special interest records are kept separate from the rest of the records, so if someone did a check it would automatically go to this special 'site'.
Its a way of keeping the number of people knowing and accessing their records.

[ummmm]

So Eddie is wrong?

[EDDIE51]

The law changed in 2012
https://www.ucheck.co.uk/dbs-checks-for-under-18s/
Read this from 'Law Change 2012'
'CRB (DBS) checks for under 16s are not allowed'.

[Baldric]

Does this apply?

///The age of criminal responsibility is currently set at 10 years in England and Wales and in Northern Ireland. Scotland has the youngest age of criminal responsibility in Europe at 8 years of age.///
http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/CBP-7687

[Baldric]

X'd posts, looks like Eddie is right, this time.

[Islay]

Unfortunately the CRB legislation got upgraded in May 2012, They have made it so even petty cautions as a child are showing up .

[Islay]

The link that Eddie has provided states that children do not need to undergo CRB checks not that they won't show up on CRB checks as an adult!

[EDDIE51]

A CRB check made as an adult WILL NOT show an offence committed when the person was under 16!
Plus the change of identity made in cases such as the Bulger boys is a TOTAL change even down to new passports ,birth certificates and a family history in the new name! It is designed to ensure that the original identity can never be discovered. If it does get discovered another new ID will be generated. This has had to be done at least twice in the last 20 years.

[Islay]

Well we will have to disagree on this Eddie because I believe they will.

[Islay]

According to this even though convictions become spent they still show up on DBS checks

http://www.childrenscommissioner.gov.uk/get-advice/questions/how-long-does-criminal-record-stay-you-if-you-were-child-when-crime-was

The list includes a range of offences which are serious, relate to sexual or violent offending or are relevant in the context of safeguarding. It would never be appropriate to filter offences on this list

[fruitsalad]

Whatever the correct rule is, Its disgusting, to think what those two did to that poor little boy, could get to work with children if they so wished. The law is definitely crazy.

[ummmm]

I think Eddie is wrong.

[ummmm]

According to Islay's link a prison term over 4 years is never spent even if committed by someone under 18.

[EDDIE51]

But in this case the Bulgar boys have a total new identity which will not show a record even if child criminal records are released.
If a CRB check showed their record there would be no point in giving them the new ID ! Their new ID is a total secret no one knows it not even the police, for the police to know would be too much of a risk, you could not be certain that their identity would never be revealed even if someone hacked the police database for example.
There will be at most one or two very senior MI5 officers who know the new ID and they are sworn by the official secrets act never to reveal it. The same people who give Russian spies who turn informer their new IDs to keep the KGB off their trail run the ID service for people like this. Believe me, if the men who used to be the Bulgar boys get a CRB check in their new names it will be clear!

[mikey4444]

Eddie has it right here....as usual !

[EDDIE51]

The story of the Bulgar boys killers are here
https://www.bizarrepedia.com/venables-and-thompson/
Venables ( who is considered insane) is alleged to have revealed his identity when drunk and has been given another new ID. Thompson is free and living under his original secret ID.

[Islay]

Please see my response at 1600, it would then go to a decision maker to decide on what was to be done.
Are you seriously suggesting Eddie that if one of the Bulger boys went for a job with children they would pass the DBS check?