M6 Smart Motorway

[malagabob]

So what is this "smart motorway then"

[dannyk13]

http://www.highways.gov.uk/roads/road-projects/m6-junction-10a-13/

[bhg481]

In simple terms, at times of high congestion the hard shoulder is brought into use as an extra lane, closely monitored by cameras. All lanes have variable speed limits, monitored by speed cameras. From my experience of other smart motorways, the system works very well.
I must admit I was very sceptical when they were first muted but I am prepared to eat my words.

[TWR]

In Theory, Excellent, in reality, I do not trust the System, I have seen umpteen Hard shoulder accidents over the years, maybe the M42 Has a clear record up until now, but it only takes a HGV to break that record & wipe out a family.

[Baldric]

Why the M42, thought this was about M6, enlighten me !

[sunny-dave]

The M42 was the prototype Smart Motorway, balders.

It's been going for a few years and works very well.

TWR is just worried that one of his angelic truckers will have a momentary lapse of concentration (probably whilst changing channels on his TV and eating his McMuffin) and wipe out some poor *** stranded on the hard shoulder.

[Baldric]

Righto Dave, enlightenment sorted, Thanks!

[TWR]

Dave, if you could see what the foreign drivers have in their cabs now ( apart from the blow up's ) it would open your eyes, Fax Machines & receiving Faxes whilst driving, the dreaded Mobiles for instructions, Excessive hours to meet dead lines / Delivery Times, yes there are overhead cameras, but that will not stop a HGV Getting a N/S/Blow out!! been there.

[mushroom25]

the only issue with the m42 seems to be that the controllers aren't very good at turning off the signs when congestion issues have passed, meaning that very restrictive speed limits persist when they don't need to.

[Old_Geezer]

More to confirm my observation that anything labelled "smart", isn't.

Hard shoulders are built because they are needed. Using them for something else is a penny pinching tactic from agencies that won't provide the needed number of lanes.

[mushroom25]

//a penny pinching tactic from agencies that won't provide the needed number of lanes. //

well not exactly. providing more lanes is incredibly invasive, particularly in urban areas, so the highways agency (as it was) are having to find other ways to increase capacity when widening schemes are blocked for environmental reasons.

[Old_Geezer]

Then they need an alternative route, or a redesign of the area.

[mushroom25]

//Then they need an alternative route, or a redesign of the area. //

why would such a scheme be any more acceptable than HS2? it would be just as damaging and disruptive, with the added "bonus" of having its pollution at point of use.

[jno]

very true, OG, much of England needs redesigning. Our planners are on to it...

[Hopkirk]

Sorry but I disagree.

Smart motorways do not have a hard shoulder at all.

The ones where the hard shoulder can be brought into use as a running lane are managed motorways.

Two different things.

In my view managed motorways are perfectly OK if run properly by the Highways Agency, while smart motorways are a dangerous cheaper option.

[mushroom25]

//The ones where the hard shoulder can be brought into use as a running lane are managed motorways. Two different things. //

not according to this:-
http://www.survivegroup.org/pages/safety-information/smart-motorways
the 2 scenarios are one and the same thing, made "smart" by the technology that permits speed changes and lane management.

[Hopkirk]

They keep moving the goalposts which is very confusing.

[New Judge]

The use of the hard shoulder as a running lane in any circumstances is a disaster waiting to happen. Since the conversion of the hard shoulder to a running lane was completed on the M25 from junctions 5 to 6 I have seen two instances of accidents occurring where the motorway was completely blocked leaving emergency vehicles unable to reach the scene without a considerable struggle. On one occasion the carriageway in the opposite direction to the incident (the one I was travelling on) had to be closed to afford access for the blue lighters.

It will not be long before a serious incident occurs where the time taken for the emergency vehicles to reach the scene is so critical that loss of life will ensue. Another great idea dreamt up by idiots.

[Ellipsis]

> It will not be long before a serious incident occurs where the time taken for the emergency vehicles to reach the scene is so critical that loss of life will ensue.

You mean like this, NJ:

http://www.ciht.org.uk/en/sorsa/news--upcoming-events/news.cfm/questions-over-what-caused-fatal-m1-crash

[New Judge]

That’s certainly one consequence of temporarily converting the hard shoulder to a running lane, Ellipsis. The stretch I mentioned on the M25 has no hard shoulder at all. It has been permanently converted into a fourth lane. All it has is emergency lay-bys at fairly lengthy intervals. If there is an accident all for lanes come to a halt an there is no easy way for emergency vehicles to reach the scene.

[Ellipsis]

> the Highways Agency revealed that almost a third of road users do not know what to do when a Red X sign is displayed

That's one problem scenario.

Another one is that somebody just doesn't notice/take in the Red X and uses the hard shoulder as a lane.

Another one is that Driver A does notice the Red X, breaks down and correctly uses the hard shoulder. While Driver A is broken down the Red X is removed, driver B ploughs up the hard shoulder and into Driver A.

Perhaps the sooner we have driverless cars, the better?