What would you do?

[wendyl]

Back in October 06 whilst my husband was driving my car with me as passenger he was flashed at traffic lights doing 13mph (40mph) limit crossing red light after amber on 3 secs! He has a clean licence since 1961 and he was filtering to left in slow busy traffic. As passenger I could see no danger but it was too late to stop with other vehicle close behind
He has to pay �60 + 3 points Apart from the fact he is a pensioner and can ill afford this, every day in the news people who cause serious accidents and injuries get off scot free many with no licence ins mot etc its no wonder they don't pay up they would be penalised like us because they could be traced!!!

[Panic Button]

So was the light actually red when he crossed?

[sifellis]

I have friends and family in the police and in the traffic dept. and this is their answer.

"An amber light is an indication to be ready to stop, not an invitation to try and squeeze through before it turns to red. Lights are configured in such a way to allow as much traffic through as possible therefore the lights are set to change withing a couple of seconds of each other. Anybody who passes through a red light has the potential to cause an horrific accident and one sure fire way of teaching people not to jump lights is to hit them where it hurts, ie your pocket.

Other stories in the news are not an excuse, as two wrongs don't make a right. Pay the fine, accept the three points and obey the rules of the road, they are laid down for our safety.

[wendyl]

According to the camera report crossed light at red 2 seconds. I was in passenger seat very heavy slow traffic at 13 mph, left into side road, realised too late to stop in no way a deliberate attempt to 'squeeze through'
Not expecting sympathy really my husband is an extremely careful driver who normally avoids peak times for travel and had only taken the route reluctantly at my request to visit a quiet trading estate on a busy Saturday morning.
He's paying anyway - getting to court to appeal would cost even more given where we live some 40 miles away and had he stopped and been hit up the back that could well have cost even more. I would just like to see those regularly speeding , using phones and illegally parking caught too - unfortunately that is not the case

[TylerTots]

pensioner you say. hmm sounds to me like another case of a slow reaction from an old driver. the ones who never cause and accident, just see lots behind them. the ones who refuse to budge from the centre lane on a motor way at 60mph. the ones who get cheap car insurance because the have been driving since 1732, when the drivng test consested of 2 questions, one of wich was ur name. tho ones who need a new clutch every 48 miles because their joints can no longer function properly. the ones who park across 2 parent / toddler spaces (cos the are the same as disabled) then get a walking stick, a cane, a flat cap and a yorkshire terrier out of the boot. and then go stand in the que in morrisons on a saturday morning to buy a packet of rich teas and some worthers. cos they dont have all week to shop.

[sifellis]

I think that the answer above is a little harsh, although being a car insurance underwriter, i'm familiar with how many accidents people over 65 cause....and believe me, it's plenty.

Without wishing to sound rude, in relation to the original topic, was this actually a question or just exasperation as he was caught and yet others aren't??

Also, for future reference, if you'd have stopped and got hit from behind, the car who hit you would've been instantly at fault because, even if you brake suddenly, he should be allowing stopping distance and would be liable in the event.

Always handy to know.

[wendyl]

I can assure you TylerTots that none of your comments about the elderly apply in this case and although a pensioner he works part time in the building trade to pay for utility bills council tax etc and car insurance, mot and road tax - thats how they catch you instead of those who do not pay (hope it doesn't include you)
And yes thanks sifellis I do realise that but sorting out damage costs from the other driver is rarely straightforward and there is a shortage of public transport in this area should the car be off road

[TylerTots]

Im sorry i was not having a pop, it wasnt aimed personaly. its just one of thoses things that generally bugs me. when i was 17 just passed my test (im now 26 no penalty points and not accidents to date) in old man pulled out of a give way junction onto me. he had stopped at the junction and overshot it by a foot. as i was on a main carrage way . i was not going to let him out. (not practical or safe) but he pulled out on me and badly damaged my car. then tried blaming me. after 3 years legal battle i was given o% of blame. because he had nothing better to do than sit at home and persue his case it went on for ever.. while i was working to pay my extortionate premiums. My point is he was clearly to blame and only paid �113 per year for his brand new mondeo insurance. I was not to blame and i have to pat �1400 for my 950cc 1983 fiesta. now in dive about a1000 miles aweek across the country and 90% of the bad driving i see is down to old people. they are in general a danger to themselves and other road users.

[Panic Button]

Well Tylertots I drive for a living, and do not see what you see! In my opinion the biggest danger on the road is young aggressive male drivers who don't give any leaway.

[oldhamfan]

If you were doing 13mph what made you think it would be dangerous to stop?

[ugly_bob]

thank you oldhamfan. At last. 13mph? I really don't think there was much of a risk of anyone hitting you (or causing any significant damage even if they did) at that speed! And if the light had been on amber for 3 seconds, surely he'd had plenty of time to react.
I can understand your frustration at getting done for it while others get away with more serious offences, but "He did it too" is not an excuse.
And as for the dangerous drivers on the road, I don't find any one demographic particulary any worse than any other - I just expect everyone to pull out in front of me when I'm overtaking them on the motorway - and they generally do

[jake-the-peg]

You know sifellis I'm interested that as an insurance underwriter you think people over 65 are involved in a lot of accidents.

People in the 60-70 age bracket actually have the fewest accidents per mile driven adjusted for the driving population.

It's when they get over 70 that the figures rocket especially women (but that may be because women live longer and it's an unbounded band so there are more 90+ women drivers etc.)

As for the offence - you can argue the rights and wrongs of a ticket for 32 in a 30 but a red light is a red light .

And as for people getting off without mot tax and insurance you only have to scan this topic for plenty of tales of woe from people being prosecuted and losing their licenses for not having proper insurance!

[johnny37]

wendyl, to get back to the original post, amber means 'stop if it is safe to do so........' not 'get ready to stop' or 'stop if you feel like it', so hubby was wrong. I know it is tempting to jump the lights and I follow the points above about people like us being easy targets. There are many people with no tax, no mot, no insurance who break all the rules and never pay any fines anyway.

[Big Bri]

he should have stopped got hit at the rear then put in a whiplash claim

[Big Bri]

amber dose not mean stop stupid read your highway code johnny37

[johnny37]

Big Bri, Can you please refer to the highway code section on Light Signals Controlling Traffic. I think you will find amber does indeed mean 'stop'.

[markja]

big bri first has to learn to read accuratly, then he may not stupidly call people stupid.
as johnnysaid amber = stop if safe : red = stop whatever.
i personally feel everybody should have to take an advanced/more difficult test every 10 years or so to prove you can drive well. ( not just enough to pass your basic test ) if you fail you get 1year in which to retake it and pass or lose mr licence 'till you do.
that'll get these rubbish drivers off the road and cut conjestion.

[dusty1]

Big Bri,
Amber do'es mean stop unless it is unsafe to do so,
Re check your highway code.
ex driving instructor