Should immigrant Britons be banned from representing GB in all sports?

[sp1814]

Someone recently asserted on AB that rather than hold athletes in high esteem who win for 'Team GB' but were born abroad, we should have them banned from representing Great Britain in all sporting events.

Is this a popularly held belief? In the US, you can only be elected President if you were born in America - should we introduce a similar ban on athletes, footballers, cricketers etc?

Or is this just the product of a particularly virulent form of right wing prejudice?

[Old_Geezer]

But surely that was obvious anyway ?

[netibiza]

All depends who trained them, if it is England, then yes they should represent England.

[LoftyLottie]

Well that cuts Mr LL out of representing GB in any sport!!

A British citizen for 58 years!!

[sp1814]

Old_Geezer

Furthermore, questions do not have to be posted neutrally. I want to make it obvious that I disagree with the notion.

Secondly, with reference to "The default is that you represent your country not any country you happen to like the look of, and who are happy to employ you are their representative." - well, Zola Budd springs to mind (ran for Great Britain simply because being South African, she could not take part in the Olympics back in the 80s).

And surely if someone has been resident in the UK and holds a British passport, it would be odd to say, "You're not really British, therefore you cannot represent Great Britain in any sporting event".

It would suggest a 'two tier' degree of nationality. Is that what we want, or should we strive for every Briton to be treated the same?

[LoftyLottie]

If you have obtained British Nationality then to me you are British. End of story. Doesn't matter where you originated from. Like you say sp, you can't have 'tiers' of Britishness. Where would it end!!

[sp1814]

Old_Geezer

You wrote:

"If you ban something then the norm is to allow it and you are imposing a restriction"

So we are in agreement. The norm is that foreign-born athletes can represent Great Britain in sporting events, as long as they hold a British passport, right?

If that normalcy was overturned, it would be a ban!

That's following the logic in your post.

[mightyWBA]

Is the ruling about U.S. Presidential candidates what the "Schwarzeneggar law" is all about?

Might have something to do with the last Austrian who managed to get a bit of power :-S

[keyplus90]

Buenchico hit the nail on the middles of head in the very first post. After that I did not have to read anything else as it gets me worried because if that goes on then I will never be able to play cricket for England so why am I working so hard then.

[netibiza]

Well on a much lower level, my daughter was born in Ibiza and she was the best high jumper they had and brought home the gold for the island, many times. when she was 14yr we had to sign a paper saying that she would not compete for England if she ever became good enough seeing as Spain trained her, so although she is British, she could have had Spanish nationality and jump for Spain. Of course she discovbered discos and boys so all that went out the window, but see?

[jake-the-peg]

So what about dual nationality?

Are they allowed to pick and choose?

[modeller]

At the moment being a member of a national term is meaningless. I am useless at sport but it would be nice to play at national level so I find a small country whose national sporting prowes are even lower than mine and I join their team for a few weeks. Everybody is happy ,I play at national level, and my adopted country is happy.

[ichkeria]

"The rules governing who can and cannot be eligible for the US Presidency has nothing to do with whether one can represent Great Britain in sporting events - ..."

That was what I was saying.

"...it's a device used as a comparison"

But not a very good one, given the above ...

[cc1]

Would it be applied to all countries or just the UK? We cannot surely apply such a rule (or whatever you want to call it) unilaterally, the vast majority of countries have competitors who were not born in that place.

[ichkeria]

"One should only be allowed to compete for one's country of birth"

Sounds simple, put like that but of course is anything but. What if I happen to be born in France but am not of French nationality?
What if I was born in France, AM French, but move to Britain at an early age, become a naturalised British citizen and take up a sport?
What if I move to Britain, but remain a French citizen, compete for France at junior level, then become a British citizen?
What if I remain a French citizen, live in France, play a sport at club level, then an English/British team manager discovers my English granny and gets me a British nationality (or perhaps not) and a place on a British/English team?

etc etc. They are all dfferent scenarios.

[jno]

jake, I think that's up to the rules of individual sports. If you play cricket for one country you aren't allowed to play it for another for x years. But that only applies to frontline cricketing nations, which is why Morgan can play for England not long after representing Ireland. But I don't think he can go back to representing Ireland again, at least not for y years. (Sorry, no idea what the actual qualifying periods are.)

[jno]

incidentally, Martin Johnson once represented New Zealand at rugby, some years before becoming England captain and winning the world cup. Not many people know that.

[sp1814]

Personally, I think it should be governed by whatever is on your passport. This shouldn't preclude anyone from playing for a local team though.

And here's where I come the biggest hypocrite on AB...

I don't think you should be allowed to represent a country other than that of your birth in the Eurovision Song Contest.

I know Katrina And The Waves won for us a few years ago, but it just seemed wrong.

[cul8ron]

It seems to me that this is yet more euphemism to achieve a desired result because we are all in such a mess about our National and/or individual identities - (am i English, British, a UK citizen etc?) - just depends on who wants to manipulate the question. And why did Northern Ireland get a separate mention in the recent IAAF Games?

[Kromovaracun]

I should probably say that I find the idea of deriving national pride from sporting events utterly stupid, which may have some impact on my views here. But I'll give them anyway.

I agree wholeheartedly with ichkeria (who for what it's worth is becoming my favourite ABer). The idea that athletes should only represent countries of birth does not account sufficiently, in my opinion, for what they are actually meant to be representing. To refer back to the original thread about Mo Farah, if he were to represent Somalia he would simply 'represent' the first few years of his life of which he probably has barely any conscious memory. If he represents the UK/England/whoever he was representing, he represents 20+ years of training, growing up here and being part of our sports community. On closer inspection, it's quite clearly this country he sure has a better claim to represent. Or that's how it seems to me anyway.