Vincent Tabak found guilty

[emmie]

I thought for one moment that he would get away with a manslaughter charge. A hideous crime, and lets hope he does the full term.

http://www.telegraph....na-Yeates-murder.html

[Frank97]

I think I first thought he was guilty of murder when I heard he had put his hands round her throat to stop her screaming. Didn't Huntley claim to have done similar to Holly and Jessica.

[firewatch]

having had a partner involved in the search for joanna, I hope this bastard rots in the fiery bowels of hell and he serves full time and dies in there he should not be allowed to walk the streets again!!

[craft1948]

I thoght he was guilty after listening to all the evidence, but then I've been wrong before as I thought Amanda Fox was guilty.............

[emmie]

D97 indeed, putting her in the boot of the car, going out drinking afterwards.
I have read about and listened to quite a lot of this case, and I believed early on, he had killed her, but it was jury who heard the evidence in court and brought in the murder charge. The parents must be devastated, I know I would be had I lost my child in this cruel way

[notasyoungasiwas]

He was guilty though craft, he admitted killing her.

[jake-the-peg]

Personally I was swayed by the claim that he only atrangled her for 20 seconds.

I'm not an expert on this and I'd suspect the jury heard evidence from someone who was but that seems an awfully short time to strangle someone fatally.

OK I'm reasonably big and a martial artist - I've had people try and strangle me and tried to strangle others and it's not as easy as it looks on TV!

People also pass out and recover.

Thing is though if he'd been found not guilty of murder I'd have assumed that the jury heard other convincing evidence that I'd not heard.

I wouldn't have thought "The bastard got away with it"


Personally I recognise my preconceptions may be wrong


What about you?

[cathfromsaron]

there's a whole science about juries decisions and people who 'look guilty'!

http://homepage.ntlwo....sturt/crime/jury.htm

but in this case he did agree that he had caused her death, so the jury were never looking at an innocent man to start with ... guilty 'of what' was all here!

[vodkancoke]

Apologies for my mistake re the jury. I mis-read something on t'internet! I don't think I belong in the news section!

[Zeuhl]

<<Can anyone (like New Judge hopefully) explain why such apparently relevant evidence as the explicit images and content of Tabak's computer showing images of strangulating women etc was excluded from the jury. I would have thought that this evidence was manifestly relevant and may have actually assisted the jury in its deliberation. >>

Sorry i'm not as knowledgeable as NJ but i assume it is to ensure a case is tried on the direct evidence not circumstantial or prejudicial information. In other words just as some murderers go to church every week and are very kind to their mothers;

lots of people look at porn and visit prostitutes - it doesn't make them murderers or necessarily more likely than anyone else to be a murderer.

so the decision needs to be based on the actual behaviour pertinent to the crime itself.

[Ann]

The right verdict! How scary it is though, to think you could be sitting next to someone on the bus who looks perfectly normal (as he did IMO) and has that kind of a mind........... I do feel for his family though, his mother may be very shocked - or may have known? It just goes to show that people are not all they seem, the poor landlord looked kinda shifty and peculiar and everyone (including me) thought it was him initially. The pics of the murderer showed a smiling kind face - ugh, so very frightening to think about!

[emmie]

There is no set look for a criminal, it could be your neighbour, friend, relative, and that is what's scary.

[Zeuhl]

True.

It reinforces the folly of thinking (and guarding against) so called 'evil people'.

I expect Tabak was lovely to many people. Most of Harold Shipman's patients found him to be an excellent family doctor who performed many good deeds.

The idea of 'evil people' isn't a very useful notion. Much safer to accept that evil behaviour can be perpetrated by almost anyone.

[Barmaid]

I suspect that the "computer porn" stuff of images of choked women formed part of a "bad character application". This would have been heard before the trial and not in front of the jury. The Judge would have needed to decide to admit or not admit depending on how it was argued. I suspect that the images were not "snuff" and therefore not sufficiently "similar fact" evidence or a sexual assault was not part of the prosecution case. I simply don't know. My suspicion is that viewing violent porn does not lead to the conclusion that it makes the def guilty of murder - ie the evidence was more prejudicial than probative. However, I don't know and this is simply a guess.

The jury convicted without such evidence. I would suggest that this makes the conviction safer (subject to any appeals on any other elements).

[Kromovaracun]

"Serious question - anybody can answer, genuinely interested when people decide these things"

I can honestly, hand on heart, say that I was undecided/neutral as to his guilt/innocence until I heard the jury's verdict. And I'm really really glad you asked this question. In my social circle/family, I was the only person who remained sceptical about the landlord - the only other people I saw doing so at the time were a few on AB. I know I say so a lot, but I'm still horrified about how the man was treated by the media and the public - I dearly hope people don't forget it.

[ladybirder]

Makes sense barmaid thanks. And yes it certainly makes the conviction safer. I bet the two jurors are feeling a bit sick though.

And ann, we didn't all think the landlord was guilty.

[naomi24]

I thought it was odd when he said he tried to kiss her and she started screaming. Seriously girls, if you invited someone into your house who subsequently tried to kiss you, would you scream - or would you just push him away? That's when I thought there must have been rather more to it than he said.

[murraymints]

I have just received notification of jury service...don't think I want that sort of responsibility....

[jewellerjim]

20 years?? He should hang for this crime.

[micmak]

I thought the landlord was quite eccentric, but that does not make him a murderer.

[old-wos-is-name]

I think we all have a bias to find a good looking person innocent, and nasty looking people, or perhaps just people who do not fit in with our idea of a normal person, guilty. Also the papers and media influence everyone a great deal. look at the landlord in this case, I think we all had him hung,drawn and quartered. Guilty , no doubt in my mind. newspapers made him out to be a pevert, looking through windows late at night etc. Strange that the media didn't know about Tabac and prostitutes etc. perhaps they were'nt hacking his phone!