Can NHS hospitals shorten your life?

[pdq1]

Not so long ago DNR (do not resucitate) was added to the notes on the foot of your bed. This was outlawed but does the practice still continue? For a patient to take up a hospital bed is very hard on hospital resources and prevents another patient from being admitted.

However cases come to light where a patient is denied the medicine he was taking before being admitted and other instances where they are denied food and water.

If the hospital wishes to terminate the life of a patient should the next of kin be informed so that in some cases they can fend for the patient at home?

[tinkerbell23]

DNAR is discussed with the patient, or if not the patient, then the family? Its nothing to do with beds, doctors and family or patient have to sign the document xx

[tinkerbell23]

Ps have you a link please? Id be interested to read xx

[VHG]

My wife's 80 year old mother had a fall at her home a couple of years ago.

She went to hospital and my wife went to visit her and her mother seemed fine.

Later in the day my wife got a phone call asking if she wanted "DNR" if her mother started to fade.

This alarmed my wife as her mother had seemed fine that morning.

The next day she started to fade and by late evening she had died.

I am convinced the hospital some how "allowed" her to die as it seemed there was little wrong with her.

I still believe if she had been at home with us and NOT is hospital she would have survived.

[gness]

Don`t know if they can but they certainly do.

[LazyGun]

Several Trusts have been warned over their use of DNR orders,but I am not sure where you get the idea such orders have been "outlawed" from. There is some confusion over their use, and there are definitely instances where such notices have been abused, but the practice has not been banned, artly because there are times when it is simply not in the patients best interest on clinical assessment, or because the patient themselves do not wish to be resuscitated.
There have been lawsuits and planned lawsuits over their (ab)use. As I understand it, part of the problem may be that there is no national policy, rather that local guidelines are implemented.

Conversely, there have beendocumente instances where DNR orders have been ignored, against the express wishes of the patient and family.

Such orders should always be discussed, where possible, with the patient and next of kin and explicit consent should be obtained. And I would be interested in links you have to denial of medication or food and water pdq... If true, thats pretty poor practice, at best.

DNR orders being too enthusiastically administered;
http://www.guardian.c...ed-resuscitate-orders

DNR requests being ignored;
http://www.dailymail....g-cardiac-arrest.html

[emmie]

it did to my o/h, no request had been made to that effect by any of us.

[Le Chat]

Several years ago my friend, who was training to be a nurse, was alone on a ward during the night shift. She phoned me for a chat and I asked if she was worried about the responsibility of being alone if something happened. She said that she wasn't, as only one patient was 'for resuss.' When I asked what that meant she said that should any of the patients take a turn for the worse, it didn't really matter as only one of them was to be administered to if in trouble.
I was shocked then and am still shocked when I think about it now!

[Euphemia]

It probably depends on the condition of the patient. For example, if a patient has incurable cancer, should they be resuscitated if they have a heart attack?

[slaney]

It could have been, Le Chat, that most of the patients on that particular ward were terminally ill.

"Ultimate responsibility for the DNR decision rests not with the patient, but with the most senior doctor in charge of the patient and he or she should document the decision and its supporting reasons on the medical records.

When arriving at a decision, the senior doctor should, whenever possible, discuss the issue with the patient and relatives (competence and confidentiality permitting) and the rest of the medical and nursing team (including the patient’s GP). Most of the time, there will be no conflict between the wishes of the patient and those of the medical team."
D Sokol, Medical Ethics Unit, Imperial College

DNR means that there should be no attempt at resuscitation; it does not mean the withdrawal of all other medical treatments.
More information here...
http://ministryofethi...uk/index.php?p=11&q=1

[Traci66]

Surely a DNR order does not shorten your life, resuscitation extends it.

[emmie]

at no point did a doctor speak to us about DNR, we were shocked beyond words.

[Everhelpful]

Google "Liverpool Path" very good and dignified, but,really it is legalised Euthanasia.This is from personal experience of the last few days with my Wife.

[pdq1]

Judging by some of the replies above DNR is decided without consent either with the patient or their family. This is totally wrong! In our case my wife's mother had her usual tablets withdrawn and within a week she died suddenly.
In her case it was nothing to do with her heart but with her kidneys.This story fits in with some of the harrowing stories above.

[Duncer]

Should it now be called the hypocritic oath?