ChatterBank1 min ago
Head of Rochdales Social services 'falls on his sword'.
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/// Greater Manchester Police investigated a complaint by a 15-year-old victim that she had been raped in 2008, but prosecutors opted not to press charges and the abuse continued. ///
/// Police have played down the racial backgrounds of the men, saying the girls – mostly from broken or ‘chaotic’ homes – were targeted because they were vulnerable, not because they were white. ///
/// Backing them, Keith Vaz, the Labour chairman of the home affairs select committee, yesterday told the Today programme that highlighting the Pakistani origin of all but one of the gang risked giving ammunition to the far-Right. ///
And wouldn't that be convenient Mr Vaz, we don't want the Nation, never mind about the Far-Right.to know about these Pakistanis do we?
There should be no cover-ups, be them British or British/Pakistani, or any other nationality, the people should know the full facts, regardless which side of politics one comes from.
/// Ms Ann Cryer, a former Labour MP in Keighley, West Yorkshire. said: ‘This is an absolute scandal. ///
/// They (the police and CPS) were petrified of being called racist and so reverted to the default of political correctness. They had a greater fear of being perceived in that light than in dealing with the issues in front of
them.’ ///
And now those others in authority who choice to ignore this disgraceful state of affairs now should either 'fall on their swords' or be sacked
/// Greater Manchester Police investigated a complaint by a 15-year-old victim that she had been raped in 2008, but prosecutors opted not to press charges and the abuse continued. ///
/// Police have played down the racial backgrounds of the men, saying the girls – mostly from broken or ‘chaotic’ homes – were targeted because they were vulnerable, not because they were white. ///
/// Backing them, Keith Vaz, the Labour chairman of the home affairs select committee, yesterday told the Today programme that highlighting the Pakistani origin of all but one of the gang risked giving ammunition to the far-Right. ///
And wouldn't that be convenient Mr Vaz, we don't want the Nation, never mind about the Far-Right.to know about these Pakistanis do we?
There should be no cover-ups, be them British or British/Pakistani, or any other nationality, the people should know the full facts, regardless which side of politics one comes from.
/// Ms Ann Cryer, a former Labour MP in Keighley, West Yorkshire. said: ‘This is an absolute scandal. ///
/// They (the police and CPS) were petrified of being called racist and so reverted to the default of political correctness. They had a greater fear of being perceived in that light than in dealing with the issues in front of
them.’ ///
And now those others in authority who choice to ignore this disgraceful state of affairs now should either 'fall on their swords' or be sacked
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Why try making an issue of race out of this - it is about (i) nailing who did it, if they did it and (ii) helping the victim rationalise it - it is not about skin colour, religion or whatever other "spin" you want to put on it. If the authorities have indeed failed, the reasons need to be looked at and appropriate remedies taken.
While I would question your use of the conotation-laden phrase 'these Pakistanis' AOG, i would agree in principle with your argument.
DTcrosswordfan - i would argue that it is entirely about skin colour.
A lot of Asian men are brought up in a cultural regime that puts women as potential wives and homemakers, and utterly off-limits as social equals or potential partners in relastionships other than marriage.
In tandem with that approach is the attitude that white women and girls are promiscuous and without morals, and are acceptable targets for young men who wish to explore their sexual experiences in advance of marriage.
So sadly, in these abuse cases, it is entirely about, if not colour, then cultural attitudes.
Yes these girls are vulnerable, but to suggest that they are not targted because of their ethnicity is naiive. Interestingly Asian girls are rarely found in these vulnerable circumstances because culturally, they enjoy far less physical freedom and choice of company.
DTcrosswordfan - i would argue that it is entirely about skin colour.
A lot of Asian men are brought up in a cultural regime that puts women as potential wives and homemakers, and utterly off-limits as social equals or potential partners in relastionships other than marriage.
In tandem with that approach is the attitude that white women and girls are promiscuous and without morals, and are acceptable targets for young men who wish to explore their sexual experiences in advance of marriage.
So sadly, in these abuse cases, it is entirely about, if not colour, then cultural attitudes.
Yes these girls are vulnerable, but to suggest that they are not targted because of their ethnicity is naiive. Interestingly Asian girls are rarely found in these vulnerable circumstances because culturally, they enjoy far less physical freedom and choice of company.
//Interestingly Asian girls are rarely found in these vulnerable circumstances because culturally, they enjoy far less physical freedom and choice of company. //
So are not available to target. I don't think for one second that they care about the colour of a girls skin. They prey on the weak and vulnerable.
So are not available to target. I don't think for one second that they care about the colour of a girls skin. They prey on the weak and vulnerable.
ummm - by default Asian girls are not 'available' to be targeted, but i think it has more to do with the perception of the predators - Asian girls are potential marriage partners for some Asian man some day, white girls are simply available disposable imoral playthings to be used and disgarded as the inferior women they are perceived to be.
There are two separate issues here: why were the girls involved all white (if they were) and why was nothing done to help them.
On the first point I don't see that there is a race issue as such. I suspect it is a case of cultural issues and convenience, rather than one of targeting people because of their race per se. But I don't know.
The insinuation that the matter was hushed up because all the offenders were Asian seems plausible but I have heard it convincingly and plausibly denied in a recent interview. There is nothing to suggest in the attached item that the resignation was caused by issues related to the other quoted in the original post.
I'd venture to suggest that if a race issue is being made of this it is being made by more than just the police, if indeed they were making an issue of it.
On the first point I don't see that there is a race issue as such. I suspect it is a case of cultural issues and convenience, rather than one of targeting people because of their race per se. But I don't know.
The insinuation that the matter was hushed up because all the offenders were Asian seems plausible but I have heard it convincingly and plausibly denied in a recent interview. There is nothing to suggest in the attached item that the resignation was caused by issues related to the other quoted in the original post.
I'd venture to suggest that if a race issue is being made of this it is being made by more than just the police, if indeed they were making an issue of it.
Thaterite - I don't think that is Grommit's point, and i think you know it is not what he is saying.
The vulnerability of any young people is the result of poor or absent parenting skils which is an ongoing problem of our society.
Just a few generations ago, young parents would have their own parents, grandparents, aunties and uncles and family friends to provide a physical and psychological support network.
Modern society has swept that away, leaving a couple of generations of young people with no idea about parenting, or the consequences of unprotected sex.
Education starting in nurseries - teaching totddlers concepts of support and friendliness and co-operation would start to heal this scar, but that takes money, and nursery education is not sexy like university and higher education is seen to be by successive governments, so the problem will go on.
The vulnerability of any young people is the result of poor or absent parenting skils which is an ongoing problem of our society.
Just a few generations ago, young parents would have their own parents, grandparents, aunties and uncles and family friends to provide a physical and psychological support network.
Modern society has swept that away, leaving a couple of generations of young people with no idea about parenting, or the consequences of unprotected sex.
Education starting in nurseries - teaching totddlers concepts of support and friendliness and co-operation would start to heal this scar, but that takes money, and nursery education is not sexy like university and higher education is seen to be by successive governments, so the problem will go on.
Brenden - I think it is simply an issue of perception - white girls are easy targets, vulnerable because they are available, and needy and prone to look for the love and affection they are missing in their home lives in the most unsuitable places.
I believe the virtual absence of Asian girls in these situations points to their physical lack of availability - rooted in the familial support that Asian families offer to their young women, which is so often lacking in white families in deprived areas.
I believe the virtual absence of Asian girls in these situations points to their physical lack of availability - rooted in the familial support that Asian families offer to their young women, which is so often lacking in white families in deprived areas.
Some Muslim girls in the UK are treated VERY harshly within the family if they step out of line - I stress SOME.
There has been reports of abuse of Muslim children by Imams, and a small amount of these reports have resulted in prosecution and imprisonment. It has been difficult to bring more to trial because the victims are pressured by their family and community to withdraw their allegations.
There are plenty of Muslim children in the foster and care system but I suspect that many victims in the Muslim community will not come forward.
There has been reports of abuse of Muslim children by Imams, and a small amount of these reports have resulted in prosecution and imprisonment. It has been difficult to bring more to trial because the victims are pressured by their family and community to withdraw their allegations.
There are plenty of Muslim children in the foster and care system but I suspect that many victims in the Muslim community will not come forward.
Thatcherite
I think the question that needs to be asked is, "If there were a ready supply if vulnerable Asian girls in care homes, who could be plied with drugs and drink - would they be targeted by these men?"
I think I understand Gromit's point - the girls aren't targeted because they're white, but because they are vulnerable, and in the area that these predators go 'hunting', the overwhelming majority of children in care, and/or who are vulnerable are white.
(Gromit...is that what you mean?)
I suspect it is much more difficult to target girls with strong family ties, and this is the cornerstone of the Asian community.
I think the question that needs to be asked is, "If there were a ready supply if vulnerable Asian girls in care homes, who could be plied with drugs and drink - would they be targeted by these men?"
I think I understand Gromit's point - the girls aren't targeted because they're white, but because they are vulnerable, and in the area that these predators go 'hunting', the overwhelming majority of children in care, and/or who are vulnerable are white.
(Gromit...is that what you mean?)
I suspect it is much more difficult to target girls with strong family ties, and this is the cornerstone of the Asian community.
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