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Nhs Identity Cards
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In view of the NHS being abused by health tourists, would the introduction of NHS membership ID cards be a good idea?
In view of the NHS being abused by health tourists, would the introduction of NHS membership ID cards be a good idea?
Answers
“we already carry an EHIC card (Or should) if we are travelling in Europe, when the boot's on the other foot.... “ The difference is, box tops, that when you pitch up to a hospital abroad the first thing they ask for (before they take your pulse) is your EHIC, credit card or medical insurance policy details. In fact some countries will not allow you entry...
17:35 Mon 04th Mar 2013
em10
Your main objection as regards ID cards seems to be that they could easily be forged, why haven't you said anything about my bank note referral?
As I have said before these are not widely forged surely.
Some are possibly forged but they are so difficult to be forged that the very small numbers that get through would not make much of a difference.
Your main objection as regards ID cards seems to be that they could easily be forged, why haven't you said anything about my bank note referral?
As I have said before these are not widely forged surely.
Some are possibly forged but they are so difficult to be forged that the very small numbers that get through would not make much of a difference.
aog
Banknotes are not personalised.
And therefore are transferable between people.
The cost of issuing a personalised 'entitlement' card, with anti-forgery features and maintaining the system would be a lot more than £10 million a year.
The usual government it system costs billions and still doesn't work properly
Banknotes are not personalised.
And therefore are transferable between people.
The cost of issuing a personalised 'entitlement' card, with anti-forgery features and maintaining the system would be a lot more than £10 million a year.
The usual government it system costs billions and still doesn't work properly
AOG
Cards themselves can be forged, but we also have to consider the IT infrastructure which would bridge both the NHS systems and those used by the Immigration services. This is how forgeries would be trapped.
First, everyone in the country would have to be registered, and then the two systems would have to be 'bridged'. I work on systems like this for a private company, and without boring you with the details, it's a nightmare to implement successfully, because you have to take account of different database back-end solutions. Data from the two systems would have to be delivered, anonomized, secured, backed up, updated...the list goes on and on.
That is all prior to the system being built if course.
Here's what happened with a £3.8billion system implemented for the Department of Work and Pensions a few years ago:
http://
Can you imagine the furore if a hastily cobbled-together system like the one suggested for NHS ID cards were to suffer a similar failure?
Finally...should we not be listening to experts in the Health industry, both providers and managers, when it comes to resolving this issue...rather than MPs, whose primary objective is to staunch the flow of supporters leaving for UKIP?
Cards themselves can be forged, but we also have to consider the IT infrastructure which would bridge both the NHS systems and those used by the Immigration services. This is how forgeries would be trapped.
First, everyone in the country would have to be registered, and then the two systems would have to be 'bridged'. I work on systems like this for a private company, and without boring you with the details, it's a nightmare to implement successfully, because you have to take account of different database back-end solutions. Data from the two systems would have to be delivered, anonomized, secured, backed up, updated...the list goes on and on.
That is all prior to the system being built if course.
Here's what happened with a £3.8billion system implemented for the Department of Work and Pensions a few years ago:
http://
Can you imagine the furore if a hastily cobbled-together system like the one suggested for NHS ID cards were to suffer a similar failure?
Finally...should we not be listening to experts in the Health industry, both providers and managers, when it comes to resolving this issue...rather than MPs, whose primary objective is to staunch the flow of supporters leaving for UKIP?
the providers seem to be part of the problem, if they don't check whether the person who they see is actually entitled to treatment then surely that's part of the problem. I do know the banks have had some problems with the 50 quid notes, forgeries turning up, or being changed in shops and they have then been refused elsewhere as dodgy..
This thread still going on ? Gosh.
The main objection to ID card is that it isn't for the citizen to prove themselves to the State. The State should not have the cheek to consider demanding it is so. The State should justify itself to its citizens. (Never mind the issue of potential abuse from hostile governments of the future.)
We have no need for cards for the NHS because if we go to a hospital is is because there is a health issue that needs to be sorted immediate for humane reasons, so we make our way to A&E (or at least we would if uncaring authorities weren't trying to close them all down). Or we have been referred to the hospital by our GP, who knows us and the referral vouches for us.
It is our foreign visitors that have a need to prove themselves. A&E should be provided as needed since no one is daft enough to come miles across countries for something that needs immediate attention; so as a caring society we deal with it. For longer term health issues the visitor should be able to identify themselves and the cost claimed back from their government and themselves in the same proportions that would be the case were they getting treatment in their own country. No country should play Lady Bountiful for the world's sick.
The main objection to ID card is that it isn't for the citizen to prove themselves to the State. The State should not have the cheek to consider demanding it is so. The State should justify itself to its citizens. (Never mind the issue of potential abuse from hostile governments of the future.)
We have no need for cards for the NHS because if we go to a hospital is is because there is a health issue that needs to be sorted immediate for humane reasons, so we make our way to A&E (or at least we would if uncaring authorities weren't trying to close them all down). Or we have been referred to the hospital by our GP, who knows us and the referral vouches for us.
It is our foreign visitors that have a need to prove themselves. A&E should be provided as needed since no one is daft enough to come miles across countries for something that needs immediate attention; so as a caring society we deal with it. For longer term health issues the visitor should be able to identify themselves and the cost claimed back from their government and themselves in the same proportions that would be the case were they getting treatment in their own country. No country should play Lady Bountiful for the world's sick.
"Far more money is wasted by missed appointments than health tourism."
I doubt that's true because all a missed appointment means is that the clinic has a bit of time to catch up meaning later patients are seen only an hour and three quarters late instead of two hours.
However that aside, my wife and I between us have missed probably half a dozen hospital appointments in the past two or three years. These have been for various scans and checks. But I should add that we did not make them, we did not ask for them but were simply told they had been made for us. It was then left to us to cancel an appointment that we did not want, did not make but which were made for us unilaterally. We were not inclined to do so and I imagine those appointments form part of those said to have been "missed".
I doubt that's true because all a missed appointment means is that the clinic has a bit of time to catch up meaning later patients are seen only an hour and three quarters late instead of two hours.
However that aside, my wife and I between us have missed probably half a dozen hospital appointments in the past two or three years. These have been for various scans and checks. But I should add that we did not make them, we did not ask for them but were simply told they had been made for us. It was then left to us to cancel an appointment that we did not want, did not make but which were made for us unilaterally. We were not inclined to do so and I imagine those appointments form part of those said to have been "missed".
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