Bedroom Tax

[marje]

So, there's been a suicide because of the 'bedroom tax'. Poor woman couldn't afford the £80 per month for 2 empty bedrooms when her children left home. How many more before it's abolished?

[woofgang]

//Say someone loses their child, or their husband, and makes a decision they no longer wish to live their life without them. That doesn't mean that person has mental health issues, surely?//

yes it does -they are not coping (obviously) and need psychiatric help to recover as best they can. They could want to kill themselves two weeks after the tragedy -but two years later feel completely different.

Magsmay, from very personal experience I can tell you that you have no idea what you are talking about.

[woofgang]

sorry, confusing way of posting that

/Say someone loses their child, or their husband, and makes a decision they no longer wish to live their life without them. That doesn't mean that person has mental health issues, surely?//
Magmay's reply
"yes it does -they are not coping (obviously) and need psychiatric help to recover as best they can. They could want to kill themselves two weeks after the tragedy -but two years later feel completely different."
My reply to Magsmay
Magsmay, from very personal experience I can tell you that you have no idea what you are talking about.

[jim360]

The thing is, though, Zeuhl, that labelling it a mental health issue then means that you can start to try and treat it. In almost all cases the reasons people contemplate suicide, or dying, are not because of some insurmountable problem, but some problems or problems that pile up rapidly and overwhelm the person's mind, or are exaggerated. To pretend that it is perfectly rational is to suggest that we should not try to do anything about it, but such people invariably need some help.

[Zeuhl]

/Choosing that you no longer want to live with a condition isn't the same as killing yourself because of £80 a month./

Ummm i agree with you, it's hard to imagine that a 53 year old didn't have other, more productive options

and like several posts, i take issue with her chosen method which affected others

[magsmay]

@Zeuhl //To dismiss that as 'mental disease' seems rather arrogant//

you are confusing mental disease with mental health .

[ummmm]

Zeuhl - It is mental health. They need help to cope.

[poppy006]

ric. We have tried unsuccessfully,ever since her youngest son went off to university,but there are NO smaller properties available out there. She cannot move out of the area,because she is my registered carer,unfortunately I do not have the space or she could move in here with me,but all this is disguising the point that we have simply ceased to care and have stopped building affordable housing...

[Zeuhl]

jim

I agree

I was merely staking a claim for the ultimate right to deny the 'labels' and simply go one's own way.

Any help intended to prevent someone wanting suicide has to acknowledge as a starting point that ultimately it is their life and their choice, whichever way they decide to go

[grasscarp]

Poppy, there are several websites that give details of council houses available for exchange. I heard one mentioned on the radio this morning, but cant remember which one they were recommending. If you google you can find them .

[woofgang]

Zeuhl. I agree

[Zeuhl]

/you are confusing mental disease with mental health . /

mags

are you suggesting there is no such thing as 'mental dis-ease'?

or is it just a semantics issue as in; multiple sclerosis is a matter of 'physical health'?

[ladybirder]

I totally agree with Naomi and I said more or less the same thing on here yesterday, albeit not as well.

[ichkeria]

My view, regardless of the arguments about suicide, mental health etc. is that a case like this was probably inevitable: the so-called "bedroom tax" is iniquitous, no matter that there is "help available".

Heaven forbid anyone should now receive "too much money" for living in a house that's too big for them.
How mean we are.
Whenever I see things like this I remember the large farms I used to drive past with their Vote Tory posters in their fields and it makes me a little cross (yes, they're all very poor I know :-) )

[Sharingan]

Interestingly one of the reasons I think I would consider taking my own life is if I were for example of the opinion I might wish to commit suicide (perfectly rationally as far as I am concerned since it is my life and not anyone else's) and then some arrogant mental health worker came along and decide to take my choice away by deciding I had a mental issue and trying to stop me doing that. Freedom is a very important right and that extends to the right of freedom to choose to die as long as you are of sound mind. It's simply lazy and disrespectful to assume anyone contemplating suicide is mentally ill.

[Octavius]

Oh dear oh dear. They would not be taking your choice away. Unless you needed to be sectioned, in which case, are you of sound enough mind to make such a decision about your own life.

Indignation for the sake of it? Lets move on.

[jim360]

What about responsibility? To friends, family? To kill yourself to spite someone else is possibly the most bizarre reason I have heard yet.

Despite what you think of suicide in general, in this specific case it was unjustified, as support was available. That should be of more concern than any perverted interpretation of freedom that means it's totally fine not to think of anyone else.

[jd_1984]

Not to seem un-sympathetic.
But is this an established reason for her suicide, or have other factors been investigated? It may be a contributory factor, ofcourse.

[ummmm]

Like I said Shar, it depends on the reasons and how you came to that decision.

To kill yourself because of a reduction in benefits does not suggest the person was of sound mind.

[cazzz1975]

people can get very stressed about money, I have a friend who has been suicidal over constant assessments by ATOS. It might not seem a reason for suicide but people do eventually snap after years or months of constant worry.

[Sqad]

Shari

\\\\ I think I would consider taking my own life is if I were for example of the opinion I might wish to commit suicide (perfectly rationally as far as I am concerned since it is my life and not anyone else's) \\\\

Wanting or considering to commit suicide is not within the limits of normal behaviour............hence it indicates a mental disorder, as mental health assumes happiness and contentment.

Are you suggesting that the mental health professional should "sit back" and allow you to take your life.........as it is "yours?"