Something Else That I Can Never Remember Happening In My Day.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/twelve-yearold-boy-among-11-arrested-for-alleged-rape-of-vulnerable-woman-in-liverpool-9816150.html

Oh but has said it did but we just didn't get to know about it in those days.

Well it seems that we also nearly didn't get to know about this one since it happened a whole month ago.

If 11 people have been arrested and now released on bail, why are the police still asking people for information.

/// "It is possible that some of those who were in the flat on the day may have talked to people, including friends or family, about what happened and if they have we would urge them to contact us." ///

They seem to have had hold of all those in the flat at the time, surely it would not have been a hard thing to question them and hear conflicting stories, after all they only children not hardened criminals who know how to talk their way out of matters.

[bookbinder]

Another example - but an extreme example - of the general lowering of standards since your day, aog, and since mine, also.

[Zeuhl]

/only children not hardened criminals /

that is a quaint assumption

as is the notion that horrible things didn't happen behind closed doors years ago; not just in the festering slums of the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s but also behind the chintz curtains of nice neighbourhoods, isolated farmhouses and mansions.

If anything, standards of behaviour have improved for the vast majority of people as the struggle to survive has become less basic.

[Mamyalynne]

Reading the article it appears there may have been more people present in the flat, and they need to find them too - two of those arrested were 18/19 years old so not quite children.


It smacks heavily of a gang type mentality where the young ones strive the follow the older members, a very dangerous situation as we know.

There have long been such gangs, Victorian Britain was rife with them.

It is an awful ordeal this poor lady has suffered and I hope they catch and deal with them all accordingly.

[anotheoldgit]

Mamyalynne

/// There have long been such gangs, Victorian Britain was rife with them. ///

Why stop at Victorian England, there were also Viking Gangs etc etc.

But even then I don't think children would be involved in rape, in fact those between 12 and 16 where still at the nudge, nudge, wink, wink, stage of sex when I was that age.

[Mamyalynne]

I have no in depth knowledge of all the particulars of all the gangs and what they did through history - I was simply commenting, not at all trying to take away from the horror of what this group have done.

In reality I don't really see why it matters if it has happened in your day, or not it needs stopping.

[Peter Pedant]

which bit didnt happen in your day ?

boys under 16 have been deemed capable of rape for the whole of the twentieth century

I think you have led too sheltered a life AOG

or else - google 'recall bias' which is exactly the thing you are exhibiting

[Zeuhl]

/I don't think children would be involved in rape, in fact those between 12 and 16 where still at the nudge, nudge, wink, wink, stage of sex when I was that age./

You obviously had a sheltered childhood aog

I know of at least one set of neighbours back in the 1950s where the siblings were sh@gg1ng each other at that age

I don't think they had a telly

[Peter Pedant]

// But even then I don't think children would be involved in rape, in fact those between 12 and 16 where still at the nudge, nudge, wink, wink, stage of sex when I was that age. //

what ?

of course they were - re-read the Sexual Offences Act 1957 which WAS around when you were young.

[anotheoldgit]

Peter Pedant

Well it seems that my only crime was hanging around with the correct crowd, I didn't realise all those kids were going around raping each other.

But then lived in a civilised area, not some back woods where they lived in caves, and strummed on their guitars and banjos.

[Mosaic]

Does it get draughty on that lofty pedestal, AOG?

[mikey4444]

For once I agree with you AOG. At age 11 this sort of thing would never have occurred to me, ever. What a wicked world it has become, for sure.

[Mamyalynne]

I realise this is your question and you can title it any way you wish but it rather changes the discussion away from the crime in the article and moves the emphasis onto historical matters.


My title may have been...


'Horrendous attack on vulnerable lady' - or similar.

[Mamyalynne]

Don't forget there were two aged 18/19 in the 11 arrested,they wield power over the young ones.

[Zeuhl]

/But then lived in a civilised area, not some back woods where they lived in caves, and strummed on their guitars and banjos./

Oh I see aog

so when you make generalisations about how much better Britain or England was in the old days, you don't mean Britain or England

You just mean the little bit where you lived

Why didn't you say so in the first place?

I was referring to dark and sordid goings-on in a 'respectable street' in one of this country's major cities. I expect it was just one example of many similar circumstances that were never discussed openly.

But as it wasn't in your little rose-tinted corner, I don't suppose it counts.

[hc4361]

The most awful crimes have gone on behind the closed doors and curtains of very middle class homes over the years. Their neighbours weren't close enough to hear it.

[RandyMarsh]

Rape and murder was invented in 1992.

[Zeuhl]

LOL

And knife crime shortly after

[Zeuhl]

I suppose the Liverpool dockers in the 1930s who grouped together on payday to walk home up The Dock Road together just had over-fertile imaginations about knife-wielding gangs lying in wait.

[FrogNog]

Well who'd have thought my guitar lessons were turning me into a savage. You live and learn.

[New Judge]

"I hope they catch and deal with them all accordingly."

Don't keep your hopes up if those caught are under 18, Mamy. Because of the ridiculous nature of the Youth Justice system in this country there is little if any chance of them being dealt with "accordingly".

And there's worse to come. The LibDems want to raise the age of criminal responsibility from 10 to 14 meaning that many of the individuals among the delightful mob under discussion here would be fireproof. It also means that the killers of Jamie Bulger would have faced no action. I also glanced at an article earlier this week (cannot remember where) which suggested that all youth crime should be decriminalised entirely !