Something Else That I Can Never Remember Happening In My Day.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/twelve-yearold-boy-among-11-arrested-for-alleged-rape-of-vulnerable-woman-in-liverpool-9816150.html

Oh but has said it did but we just didn't get to know about it in those days.

Well it seems that we also nearly didn't get to know about this one since it happened a whole month ago.

If 11 people have been arrested and now released on bail, why are the police still asking people for information.

/// "It is possible that some of those who were in the flat on the day may have talked to people, including friends or family, about what happened and if they have we would urge them to contact us." ///

They seem to have had hold of all those in the flat at the time, surely it would not have been a hard thing to question them and hear conflicting stories, after all they only children not hardened criminals who know how to talk their way out of matters.

[hc4361]

AOG, you should find this article interesting
http://www.historyextra.com/feature/youth-culture-and-crime-what-can-we-learn-history

[Zeuhl]

/Jamie Bulger/

sorry NJ but James Bulger - James

[Mamyalynne]

I know that sadly NJ - but as said one can hope and if the older members of this gang/group are dealt with it may,just may send out a message to the younger ones.


They may of course be too far gone but trying to turn them round is essential.

[Peter Pedant]

dear old AOG // But then lived in a civilised area, not some back woods where they lived in caves, and strummed on their guitars and banjos.//

I read this as: but then I lived in some backwoods where they lived in caves and strummed on their guitars and banjos.

and I thought: oh ! and Deliverance was a word in the Lords prayer and not a hit film of 1972

[BlackadderV]

'Deliverance' does not feature in the Lord's Prayer, though 'deliver' does. Of course I was brought up on the BCP, totally non-PC these days.

[anotheoldgit]

hc4361

/// The most awful crimes have gone on behind the closed doors and curtains of very middle class homes over the years. Their neighbours weren't close enough to hear it. ///

It must have been very widely reported in working class terraced homes then, the walls were so thin I believe.

[hc4361]

Yes, it was, and neighbours cocked a deaf ear.

[ummmm]

NJ - wasn't the age of criminal responsibility lowered because of the James Bulger case?

And Zeuhl is right, his parents never called him Jamie, that was the media.

Same as Madeleine McCann....her parents never called her Maddie.

[anotheoldgit]

hc4361

/// AOG, you should find this article interesting ///

Yes very interesting and after reading it in it's entirety, no where does it mention sex crime amongst children, it only focuses on youth crime, Teddy Boys, theft of consumer goods etc. etc.

[New Judge]

Yes apologies for getting Master Bulger's name wrong and thanks for the correction. You know how it is when you're typing quickly from memory.

No, the age of criminal responsibility was not altered to accommodate that case. It used to be eight but was raised to ten in 1963 and has remained there ever since (though I believe Scotland has recently raised it to 12 but cannot be sure without checking). There are many and frequent attempts to have it increased but these have been so far resisted.

However, to give you a flavour of the wooly headed thinking (if you can call it that) among those campaigning for a change, here's a quote from Dr Maggie Atkinson who was (don't know if she still is) "children's commissioner" in 2010. There was one of the regular debates ongoing about the age of responsibility and Dr Atkinson made reference to the Bulger case. Suggesting that Jon Venables and Robert Thomson should not have been tried in an adult court she said:

"What they did was exceptionally unpleasant..."

An understatement if ever there was one. To torture and subsequently murder a toddler is slightly more than "exceptionally unpleasant" in my book.

Professor Rod Morgan, former chairman of the Youth Justice Board, said: "In no other country in Western Europe would Jon Venables have been prosecuted."

So a crime so horrific as the murder of James Bulger goes completely unaddressed. That would be the consequence of raising the age of criminal responsibility.

But prof Morgan is quite right. The UK does have the lowest age of criminal responsibility in Western Europe but for once I think the rest of the world could take lessons from us rather than we from them.

However, that is not the entire point I was making earlier. The range of options open to Youth courts (and indeed Crown courts when dealing with youths) is extremely limited (especially in the lower court) and there is no doubt in my mind that many young people, particularly those of 15-17, are not being dealt with "accordingly" for serious or repetitive crime.