If There Was Any Doubt Of Labour's Anti...
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The "establishment" Must Be Sleeping Somewhat Uneasy In Their Beds Tonight.
This could be the biggie ::::::
http://
if it links up with the Elm Guest House investigations, than this could blow the roof off some very important places. Lets hope this investigation isn't sabotaged by MI5, as the others have been in the past.
http://
if it links up with the Elm Guest House investigations, than this could blow the roof off some very important places. Lets hope this investigation isn't sabotaged by MI5, as the others have been in the past.
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I am more optimistic than you Mush.
The cat is well and truly out of the bag on this issue of wide-spread paedophile activity amongst the Great and Good. I have my fingers crossed that at last we might see some much-needed progress in this area. All the many victims still alive deserve nothing less than justice.
The cat is well and truly out of the bag on this issue of wide-spread paedophile activity amongst the Great and Good. I have my fingers crossed that at last we might see some much-needed progress in this area. All the many victims still alive deserve nothing less than justice.
The abused have to be heard and we have to make sure they are. We cannot let it be swept under the carpet and hidden away again by anybody. There must surely be enough good people with power and influence in this country today who are as keen as we are to bring the perpetrators to justice and not let it be swept under the carpet by anybody. Am I being naive, I hope not, for the sake of the abused.
Back yet again,mikey, with one of your favourite hobby horses. You really do seem to have a curious obsession with all things paedophillic. You tell mush that you are optimistic of much needed progress in this area.
I told you on your other thread today that the police had both hands tied behind their back and were well and truly gagged by government intervention (that could also be interpreted as MI5) with regard to investigations in the past. You seem to have dismissed my protest in the defence of the police and claimed it was their mistakes and ineptitude that didn't bring known paedophiles to book in previous historic cases. Now you have made a U turn and state you are more optimistic than mush that it won't be whitewashed by the investigator with a huge brush and a huge tin of snowcem. So you might agree that previous police investigations were white washed but you didn't accept they may of been whitewashed by government pressure. You hope the investigations are not sabotaged by MI5 as they were in the past. MI5 are not the police mikey but they have the power to stifle the police investigations at the governments behest.
Mushroom states that some of the perpetrators are still alive and could well be high profile figures who will never be exposed due to security risks. By that,I would read government figures who also escaped exposure in previous historic cases i.e. Cyril Smith. I see no protest from you in mushrooms statement and conjecture yet when I suggested to you on your other post today on the same subject that I had anecdotal evidence from a former Thames Valley police officer that pressure was brought to bear on the Chief Constable to shelve any impending arrests you dismissed that as mistakes made by police and NOT government interference. Make your mind up mikey. Was it police mistakes or MI5 sabotaging police investigations in the past as you have now, just, inferred?
I told you on your other thread today that the police had both hands tied behind their back and were well and truly gagged by government intervention (that could also be interpreted as MI5) with regard to investigations in the past. You seem to have dismissed my protest in the defence of the police and claimed it was their mistakes and ineptitude that didn't bring known paedophiles to book in previous historic cases. Now you have made a U turn and state you are more optimistic than mush that it won't be whitewashed by the investigator with a huge brush and a huge tin of snowcem. So you might agree that previous police investigations were white washed but you didn't accept they may of been whitewashed by government pressure. You hope the investigations are not sabotaged by MI5 as they were in the past. MI5 are not the police mikey but they have the power to stifle the police investigations at the governments behest.
Mushroom states that some of the perpetrators are still alive and could well be high profile figures who will never be exposed due to security risks. By that,I would read government figures who also escaped exposure in previous historic cases i.e. Cyril Smith. I see no protest from you in mushrooms statement and conjecture yet when I suggested to you on your other post today on the same subject that I had anecdotal evidence from a former Thames Valley police officer that pressure was brought to bear on the Chief Constable to shelve any impending arrests you dismissed that as mistakes made by police and NOT government interference. Make your mind up mikey. Was it police mistakes or MI5 sabotaging police investigations in the past as you have now, just, inferred?
Samuraisan,
Well once upon a time a certain former minister for health (Labour) was a legal adviser to NCCL . The NCCL accepted the Paedophile Information Exchange as an affiliated member. Apparently the P.I.E with the legal advise from former Labour minister who was acting also in her role as solicitor for the NCCL submitted a 70 odd page document to request the age of consent for sex between children and adults be abolished. It should only be allowed though if the sex took place with the consent of the child otherwise that may be regarded as wrong. As if a 3year old toddler will consent to having unspeakable acts committed against them!!! so as to try to answer your question as to why anyone would want to be a paedophile, you only have to see that high profile figures seem to endorse paedophilia and indeed try to obtain government funding for a Paedophile Information Exchange so it must be OK then!!. But I believe mikey,who has suddenly become conspicuous by his absence again, would be a better more informed person to address your question as he seems to think he is the self proclaimed expert on all things paedophilic. After all he has only posted 11 Ops since 3/11/14 and that is eons after news broke that Savile was a paedophile. He won't mention any Labour involvement but I would think he is salivating, as I type, if he heard the suggestion on the ITV 10o'clock news tonight that two high profile Tory MPs may have been involved in the Dolphin Sq murder investigations.
Well once upon a time a certain former minister for health (Labour) was a legal adviser to NCCL . The NCCL accepted the Paedophile Information Exchange as an affiliated member. Apparently the P.I.E with the legal advise from former Labour minister who was acting also in her role as solicitor for the NCCL submitted a 70 odd page document to request the age of consent for sex between children and adults be abolished. It should only be allowed though if the sex took place with the consent of the child otherwise that may be regarded as wrong. As if a 3year old toddler will consent to having unspeakable acts committed against them!!! so as to try to answer your question as to why anyone would want to be a paedophile, you only have to see that high profile figures seem to endorse paedophilia and indeed try to obtain government funding for a Paedophile Information Exchange so it must be OK then!!. But I believe mikey,who has suddenly become conspicuous by his absence again, would be a better more informed person to address your question as he seems to think he is the self proclaimed expert on all things paedophilic. After all he has only posted 11 Ops since 3/11/14 and that is eons after news broke that Savile was a paedophile. He won't mention any Labour involvement but I would think he is salivating, as I type, if he heard the suggestion on the ITV 10o'clock news tonight that two high profile Tory MPs may have been involved in the Dolphin Sq murder investigations.
Gromit
How do you arrive at the suggestion that the police are fishing and the investigation will be going nowhere? D.Spt Kenny Mcdonald was quoted as saying the witness/victim was a credible and truthful witness and has asked for other victims in this case to come forward. That is S.O.P. in police investigations in order to obtain enough credible evidence in order to secure a conviction. That is why Crimewatch was televised for the same reason. To secure witnesses. The problem is, that since the investigation may involve high profile government figures the police will have to ensure a cast iron, waterproof case to proceed with a successful prosecution without outside agency interference. I really hope that if enough evidence is obtained for a prosecution they keep it under wraps until any possible trial goes to the Old Bailey. I recall too much information being divulged by the police in their investigation in the Lawrence murder investigation and the Daily Mail splashed the suspects names over the front page and the trial collapsed as did the subsequent private prosecution. Lets sit back and say little but watch any future developments or non developments as they do or do not arise
How do you arrive at the suggestion that the police are fishing and the investigation will be going nowhere? D.Spt Kenny Mcdonald was quoted as saying the witness/victim was a credible and truthful witness and has asked for other victims in this case to come forward. That is S.O.P. in police investigations in order to obtain enough credible evidence in order to secure a conviction. That is why Crimewatch was televised for the same reason. To secure witnesses. The problem is, that since the investigation may involve high profile government figures the police will have to ensure a cast iron, waterproof case to proceed with a successful prosecution without outside agency interference. I really hope that if enough evidence is obtained for a prosecution they keep it under wraps until any possible trial goes to the Old Bailey. I recall too much information being divulged by the police in their investigation in the Lawrence murder investigation and the Daily Mail splashed the suspects names over the front page and the trial collapsed as did the subsequent private prosecution. Lets sit back and say little but watch any future developments or non developments as they do or do not arise
Canary,
Yes paedophilia is an odious subject to post continually as a debate. I agree.
It also becomes a little disturbing to see it being posted so many times by the same person who probably knows little about police investigative procedures yet is happy to snipe at them because of what may have been read and sourced from the Daily Barry Bugle or the Daily tai bach trumpet. Yes the book about Cyril Smith has been mentioned. Too many times. We have been urged to buy it or read it too many times. No mention made that Cyril Smith was a former Labour member before defecting to the Lib/Dems though. I suppose that fact is easily accessible on google but I just don't seem to have that perverse avid interest in paedophilia apart from the fact that I hope justice will prevail eventually without prejudice, undue pressure or fear or favour from outside influences and conjecture from sad old gossips who we see regularly posting about this subject on AB.
Yes paedophilia is an odious subject to post continually as a debate. I agree.
It also becomes a little disturbing to see it being posted so many times by the same person who probably knows little about police investigative procedures yet is happy to snipe at them because of what may have been read and sourced from the Daily Barry Bugle or the Daily tai bach trumpet. Yes the book about Cyril Smith has been mentioned. Too many times. We have been urged to buy it or read it too many times. No mention made that Cyril Smith was a former Labour member before defecting to the Lib/Dems though. I suppose that fact is easily accessible on google but I just don't seem to have that perverse avid interest in paedophilia apart from the fact that I hope justice will prevail eventually without prejudice, undue pressure or fear or favour from outside influences and conjecture from sad old gossips who we see regularly posting about this subject on AB.
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Canary...thanks for your support at 01:34.
I have mentioned Cyril Smith many times on here and Simon Danzcuk's illuminating book. Quite what point Retro is trying to make here is unclear. The fact that Smith was a Labour politician and then became a Liberal one has no relevance whatsoever when it comes to his dreadful abusing or the fact that an investigation was discontinued by MI5.
The reason that MI5 stepped in to stymie the investigation was that if a prosecution did go ahead, he would spill the beans on many others involved in his preferred method of sexual gratification. Some of those "others" were also involved in what went on at the Elm Guest House, and some are still alive. In other words, Smith knew where the bodies were buried. Bearing in mind this new investigation around Dolphin Square, that may literally true !
Retro has taken every opportunity to make personal attacks and slurs on me for the past few days. I am not sure what his motive is but it is now turning into behaviour more suited to a troll. As a result, I will no longer engage in debate with him, on this subject or any other. Life is too short to waste any more time with characters like him. He won't like this of course, but I couldn't care less. But if he continues to spread his nasty innuendo, I shall report him.
Sandy...its true that some of the abusers may not still be alive but lots of them are still with us. I am prevented from naming names on this public forum, but a little research brings pays great dividends.
Ladybirder...you are absolutely right. The victims needs some kind of resolution. You are not being naive at all, just optimistic that this issue is investigated thoroughly, as we should all be on here.
I have mentioned Cyril Smith many times on here and Simon Danzcuk's illuminating book. Quite what point Retro is trying to make here is unclear. The fact that Smith was a Labour politician and then became a Liberal one has no relevance whatsoever when it comes to his dreadful abusing or the fact that an investigation was discontinued by MI5.
The reason that MI5 stepped in to stymie the investigation was that if a prosecution did go ahead, he would spill the beans on many others involved in his preferred method of sexual gratification. Some of those "others" were also involved in what went on at the Elm Guest House, and some are still alive. In other words, Smith knew where the bodies were buried. Bearing in mind this new investigation around Dolphin Square, that may literally true !
Retro has taken every opportunity to make personal attacks and slurs on me for the past few days. I am not sure what his motive is but it is now turning into behaviour more suited to a troll. As a result, I will no longer engage in debate with him, on this subject or any other. Life is too short to waste any more time with characters like him. He won't like this of course, but I couldn't care less. But if he continues to spread his nasty innuendo, I shall report him.
Sandy...its true that some of the abusers may not still be alive but lots of them are still with us. I am prevented from naming names on this public forum, but a little research brings pays great dividends.
Ladybirder...you are absolutely right. The victims needs some kind of resolution. You are not being naive at all, just optimistic that this issue is investigated thoroughly, as we should all be on here.
Bouncer33
Au contraire. I am very vehemently anti- paedophile. I am also anti constant police sniping on this subject. I have tried to explain that the police investigations were stifled by government influences from the start.
But that doesn't fit nicely in the poster's agenda to put the blame on the police. I mentioned Savile and how a Thames Valley police detective had to drop his enquiry and the imminent arrest of Savile due to governmental pressure put on the Chief Constable. That is anecdotal evidence from a former Thames Valley police officer which was personally related to me.The information on Savile that the detective had acquired, had incidentally been passed on by officers from a Yorkshire force who it would seem had also been gagged. That is largely the reason why Savile, Stoke Mandeville Hospital and the police service area in which it lies is linked.
Savile was not an MP but the poster is now U turning and talking about knowing where the bodies lie and spilling the beans on other enquiries where MP's may be involved. I have tried to explain that it was not a decision to ignore further investigations and they had no reason not to investigate unless, the beans are spilled and a whole politcal embarrassing can of worms is revealed. Now that would be in THE GOVERNMENT's interest NOT to have the investigations conducted not the polices. As that scenario didn't agree with the police sniping agenda by the poster it was,at first denied by him. Many people on this site know that if their views are not in agreement with those of this particular poster then they are accused of talking drivel. It, however, seems to be sinking in to the poster after reading the back pedalling that he believes it was government influence and names MI5 as to the reason why this whole subject has never been investigated properly from the outset. Because it involves government.
Now it begs the question that if there were no government high profile figures involved in these paedophile rings would the police of been allowed to investigate the likes of Savile.I don't know the true answer to that but I would think Yes. Hope that clears up any of your ideas that I am pro paedophile.
Au contraire. I am very vehemently anti- paedophile. I am also anti constant police sniping on this subject. I have tried to explain that the police investigations were stifled by government influences from the start.
But that doesn't fit nicely in the poster's agenda to put the blame on the police. I mentioned Savile and how a Thames Valley police detective had to drop his enquiry and the imminent arrest of Savile due to governmental pressure put on the Chief Constable. That is anecdotal evidence from a former Thames Valley police officer which was personally related to me.The information on Savile that the detective had acquired, had incidentally been passed on by officers from a Yorkshire force who it would seem had also been gagged. That is largely the reason why Savile, Stoke Mandeville Hospital and the police service area in which it lies is linked.
Savile was not an MP but the poster is now U turning and talking about knowing where the bodies lie and spilling the beans on other enquiries where MP's may be involved. I have tried to explain that it was not a decision to ignore further investigations and they had no reason not to investigate unless, the beans are spilled and a whole politcal embarrassing can of worms is revealed. Now that would be in THE GOVERNMENT's interest NOT to have the investigations conducted not the polices. As that scenario didn't agree with the police sniping agenda by the poster it was,at first denied by him. Many people on this site know that if their views are not in agreement with those of this particular poster then they are accused of talking drivel. It, however, seems to be sinking in to the poster after reading the back pedalling that he believes it was government influence and names MI5 as to the reason why this whole subject has never been investigated properly from the outset. Because it involves government.
Now it begs the question that if there were no government high profile figures involved in these paedophile rings would the police of been allowed to investigate the likes of Savile.I don't know the true answer to that but I would think Yes. Hope that clears up any of your ideas that I am pro paedophile.
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