Do We Want This Type Of Thing To Return?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3266090/Revealed-dark-history-Hitler-s-death-camp-Nazis-murdered-psychiatric-patients-nurses-test-gas-chambers-used-mass-extermination-Jews.html

When we are reminded (as in this article) of fairly recent past atrocities that were carried out in the name of other evil inhuman indoctrination, can we afford not to join Russia in their bid to rid the middle East of ISIS?

Who knows unless it is now stopped, this type of ideology could now spread all over Europe, as was in the case during WW2?

[EDDIE51]

The problem is Russia is NOT trying to rid the world if ISIS !
It is trying to ensure it's murderous henchman Assad remains in power, they are targeting anyone who is opposed to him.

[retrocop]

Trouble is aog Russia was just as guilty as Nazi Germany when it came to eliminating people. In fact I believe,under Stalin, their butcher's bill was a lot higher. I am thinking of the Katyn forest massacre of Polish officers by Stalin who tried to pin it on the Nazis.

[anotheoldgit]

retrocop

Welcome back retro, nice to have you back on the site.

Yes I agree Russia under Stalin, was on par with the Nazis during WW2, but the ordinary Russian sacrificed greatly, and although it's hard to say, I don't think we could have won if they had not been on our side.

But this is a complete ball game now, and once again we need the help of Russia, and of course others if we are to rid the world of ISIS.

[andy-hughes]

No.

[naomi24]

No we don't - but if IS get their way the butchers' bill will outstrip all that has gone before.

[Peter Pedant]

what a complete non seqitur

can anyone - anyone out there explain to me what the Nazi extermination camps have to do with Russian involvement in Syria ?

I wonder if this is a :esson from history question
but what lesson
and what does it teach us ?

[retrocop]

Thanks aog

[Sqad]

Yes, good to see you back retrocop.

[naomi24]

From me too Retrocop. :o)

[Baldric]

Hi Retro welcome home!

[retrocop]

Thanks Sqad and naomi :-)

[retrocop]

and my old mucker baldric.Good to be back. :-)

[anotheoldgit]

Peter Pedant

/// I wonder if this is a :esson from history question
but what lesson
and what does it teach us ? ///

Man's inhumanity to man, perhaps?

And that we should take every opportunity to learn lessons from the past, and that such things should be stamped out, no matter who's side we need to join, in a bid to defeat a common enemy.

[sp1814]

Peter Pedant

Thanks - you've kinda summed up what I was thinking.

AOG - I don't think anyone in their right mind could answer 'yes' to your heading question.

But as a general question - what exactly do you mean when you ask about joining Russia.

Are you talking about boots on the ground, drone strikes, support for rebels?

It would be interesting to hear what you propose, because without an idea of what you mean, no-one can really say "yes" or "no" to the second part of your OP.

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

I thought I had made it very clear on numerous occasions, that I have no wish whatsoever to see British boots on the ground, but we should not be opposing Russia if they are prepared themselves to carry out the work that desperately needs to be done.

[Orderlimit]

"can we afford not to join Russia in their bid to rid the middle East of ISIS?"

Good question Mr AOG.

This may poll may interest you (or not):

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/09/29/public-west-should-join-russia-fight-against-isis/

[anotheoldgit]

Orderlimit

Thanks for that.

[andy-hughes]

I do not believe that appropriate parallels exist in order to make this anything approaching a meaningful comparison.

The Nazi war machine had the financial and emotional backing of a large European country behind it, and it was run by people with more than a passing knowledge of military strategy.

Isis is run by a ragged bunch of fanatics who live in a twelfth century feudal system that does not exist outside its own borders.

The notion that one could become the other is frankly farcical - and even the Mail, hysterical as it usually is with its scaremongering, is not drawing a parallel here - mainly because there isn't one.

[youngmafbog]

Andy, surely just putting ISIS down to a bunch of ragged fanatics is rather an ostrich like approach and a dangerous on e at that.

The intentions od ISIS do mirror that of the Nazi's. World dominantion both a mount to the same thing in terms of slaughter.

Should we support Russia? I'm not perhaps we should just all stare at our shoes whilst they get on with it. The West has too many liberal apologists in it's midst to do - Putin won't give a monkeys about them so will at least get the job done. (Yes, I accept he will get rid of more than just ISIS)

[sp1814]

AOG

Are we opposing Russia now?

In your question, you asked 'can we afford not to join Russia?'

'joining' and 'not opposing' are two entirely different states.

And andy_hughes raises a pertinent point...Islamic State is not a country. It's an ideology. It has no recognised head of state, or central government.

Whatever lessons we learned from previous wars are moot here, because the rules of engagement are completely different.

That's why I asked what kind of strategies you would suggest we employ, because personally, I think the only solution is the one I heard in the first episode of Homeland last night...and there's not a government in the world who would sign up for that.