News4 mins ago
Not News, But Am I A Racist?
My wife and I have just returned from a 'come as your hero' party.
I went as Rick James who, in my opinion, is the most unrecognised piece of brilliance ever to have uttered a note (Google Fire and Desire - just superb).
Anyway, I blacked-up. And about 45 minutes ago was told I was racist for doing so. I tried to explain that as Rick James is a hero so how on earth can it be racist, but it fell on death ears.
So, an I wrong or, if as I suspect, is my accuser a complete moron?
I went as Rick James who, in my opinion, is the most unrecognised piece of brilliance ever to have uttered a note (Google Fire and Desire - just superb).
Anyway, I blacked-up. And about 45 minutes ago was told I was racist for doing so. I tried to explain that as Rick James is a hero so how on earth can it be racist, but it fell on death ears.
So, an I wrong or, if as I suspect, is my accuser a complete moron?
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AOG
The tradition of minstrels/blacking up is offensive, not because black people are ashamed of their skin, but because of the history of the act. It was never done with respect. Minstrels were white people acting like 'foolish blacks'.
Blackface is much more than just dark makeup used to enhance a costume.
Its American origins can be traced to minstrel shows. In the mid to late nineteenth century, white actors would routinely use black grease paint on their faces when depicting plantation slaves and free blacks on stage.
To be clear, these weren't flattering representations.
At all.
Taking place against the backdrop of a society that systematically mistreated and dehumanized black people, they were mocking portrayals that reinforced the idea that African-Americans were inferior in every way.
The blackface caricatures that were staples of Minstrelsy (think: Mammy, Uncle Tom, Buck, and Jezebel) took a firm hold in the American imagination, and carried over into other mediums of entertainment.
The Morris Dancers however are a completely different story as far as I can tell, and people need to understand that they are not portraying black people at all. As far as I'm aware it's something to do with miners isn't it?
The tradition of minstrels/blacking up is offensive, not because black people are ashamed of their skin, but because of the history of the act. It was never done with respect. Minstrels were white people acting like 'foolish blacks'.
Blackface is much more than just dark makeup used to enhance a costume.
Its American origins can be traced to minstrel shows. In the mid to late nineteenth century, white actors would routinely use black grease paint on their faces when depicting plantation slaves and free blacks on stage.
To be clear, these weren't flattering representations.
At all.
Taking place against the backdrop of a society that systematically mistreated and dehumanized black people, they were mocking portrayals that reinforced the idea that African-Americans were inferior in every way.
The blackface caricatures that were staples of Minstrelsy (think: Mammy, Uncle Tom, Buck, and Jezebel) took a firm hold in the American imagination, and carried over into other mediums of entertainment.
The Morris Dancers however are a completely different story as far as I can tell, and people need to understand that they are not portraying black people at all. As far as I'm aware it's something to do with miners isn't it?
Deskdiary
The way round your predicament is so very easy. You could go as Rick James, Stevie Wonder, Diana Ross or whomsoever your choose, but just drop the blackface make-up.
I guarantee, everyone would have know who you were. If you donned a pair of sunglasses, a fake moustache and a gold kaftan, people would know you were Stevie Wonder.
Same with Rick James.
Without you having to black up, I think most people would get your costume as long as your had the right corn rows, costume and platforms.
The way round your predicament is so very easy. You could go as Rick James, Stevie Wonder, Diana Ross or whomsoever your choose, but just drop the blackface make-up.
I guarantee, everyone would have know who you were. If you donned a pair of sunglasses, a fake moustache and a gold kaftan, people would know you were Stevie Wonder.
Same with Rick James.
Without you having to black up, I think most people would get your costume as long as your had the right corn rows, costume and platforms.
ok Border Morris is not banned for a kick off.
Secondly I (and loads of women) have experience of other people deciding for us whether something is offensive or not...anyone remember the 70's and male chauvinist pig behaviour?....which of course was "not offensive....just a bit of fun....a compliment.....showing admiration.....jeez can't you women take a joke?" So yes I believe strongly that its not up to white people to decide whether blacking up to impersonate a black person is offensive..... BUT neither is it up to anyone else do decide to be offended on their behalf.
So far as "lets call a fat person fat because I am fed up with PC" personal comments unless they are appropriate compliments appropriately delivered have never been considered good manners and in my opinion excusing them by complaining about PC gone mad does not wash.
Secondly I (and loads of women) have experience of other people deciding for us whether something is offensive or not...anyone remember the 70's and male chauvinist pig behaviour?....which of course was "not offensive....just a bit of fun....a compliment.....showing admiration.....jeez can't you women take a joke?" So yes I believe strongly that its not up to white people to decide whether blacking up to impersonate a black person is offensive..... BUT neither is it up to anyone else do decide to be offended on their behalf.
So far as "lets call a fat person fat because I am fed up with PC" personal comments unless they are appropriate compliments appropriately delivered have never been considered good manners and in my opinion excusing them by complaining about PC gone mad does not wash.
I agree that "it's PC gone mad" is often just code for "I like offending people and I'm annoyed that nowadays it's frowned upon to be an obnoxious git".
Still, I'd like to know *who* called DD out on this. If it was someone who is getting offended on behalf of someone else then they probably should have kept it to themselves. I wouldn't have "blacked up" and would strongly discourage people from doing it, but then freedom has to include freedom to be a complete dolt (as well as freedom to be called a complete dolt).
But anyway. Lots of times things were meant respectfully, but don't come across that way, and it bothers me that people don't make allowances for this.
Still, I'd like to know *who* called DD out on this. If it was someone who is getting offended on behalf of someone else then they probably should have kept it to themselves. I wouldn't have "blacked up" and would strongly discourage people from doing it, but then freedom has to include freedom to be a complete dolt (as well as freedom to be called a complete dolt).
But anyway. Lots of times things were meant respectfully, but don't come across that way, and it bothers me that people don't make allowances for this.
You'd have got noticed if Max Sr had done your hair and make up.
https:/
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AOG
You asked:
//Why did you bother to try and educate me regarding black minstrels.//
Because you posted:
//Why are black people so touchy about the colour of their skin, surely they should be proud of it?//
It's in the context of 'blacking up'. I think it's a mistake to call someone a racist for emulating a black hero, but there is a thread that links that to blackface which makes a lot of people uncomfortable. That thread began with minstrels.
I wonder of minstrels never existed, would blackface be such an issue?
It's impossible to say.
You asked:
//Why did you bother to try and educate me regarding black minstrels.//
Because you posted:
//Why are black people so touchy about the colour of their skin, surely they should be proud of it?//
It's in the context of 'blacking up'. I think it's a mistake to call someone a racist for emulating a black hero, but there is a thread that links that to blackface which makes a lot of people uncomfortable. That thread began with minstrels.
I wonder of minstrels never existed, would blackface be such an issue?
It's impossible to say.
woofgang
/// ok Border Morris is not banned for a kick off. ///
Really????
http://
http://
/// ok Border Morris is not banned for a kick off. ///
Really????
http://
http://
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