Which Leaver Will Take Charge?

[Marshwarble]

Okay, place your bets. Gove? Johnson? Rees-Mogg?

[New Judge]

"This error was further compounded by making the referendum mandatory on the Government."

It was not mandatory, Canary. Although the government's pamphlet said "The government will implement what you decide" there was no legal or constitutional reason for them to abide by that. As was demonstrated by Gina Miller, the decision to invoke A50 had to be taken by the Commons and that vote could have been lost. As it was the Commons voted five to one to invoke A50.

"If any of our PMs since Thatcher had had her tenacity and determination when negotiating within the EU we wouldn't have needed a referendum, the membership of the EU would have still been a positive feature in our economy"

I'm afraid I do not share your enthusiasm. Even if TGL herself had remained in power until now, the EU would have long ago lost any attraction for the UK and its wellbeing. "The Project" (to create a single European Federal State) has now become so paramount that the interests of any individual member is simply an annoyance and any member creating waves is simply brushed aside.There is a huge democratic deficit demonstrated by the EU and the wishes of the citizens are swatted away. The Euromaniacs' major policies have consigned huge swathes of people in the peripheral nations to a generation or more of penury and this is particularly evident among the young.

If you think I'm exaggerating or being hysterical, have a look at some of the quotes of Jean-Claude Juncker when commentating on EU issues before he became the biggest of the EU's grande fromages:

On Greece's economic meltdown in 2011: "When it becomes serious, you have to lie."

On EU monetary policy: "I'm ready to be insulted as being insufficiently democratic, but I want to be serious ... I am for secret, dark debates"

On British calls for a referendum over Lisbon Treaty: “Of course there will be transfers of sovereignty. But would I be intelligent to draw the attention of public opinion to this fact?,”

On French referendum over EU constitution: “If it's a Yes, we will say 'on we go', and if it's a No we will say 'we continue’,”

On the introduction of the euro: "We decide on something, leave it lying around, and wait and see what happens. If no one kicks up a fuss, because most people don't understand what has been decided, we continue step by step until there is no turning back."

On eurozone economic policy and democracy: “We all know what to do, we just don't know how to get re-elected after we've done it”

(This last issue, of course, is something he no longer has to trouble himself with).

The EU is a self-serving, protectionist organisation that treats anything that is unregulated (by the EU, natch) as if it should be illegal. Nobody can control it, least of all its members, and the only thing to do is to leave.

[ichkeria]

At some point Corbyn will have to except the reality that roughly 80% of his supporters are against leaving the EU, it to mention the fact that many core labour voters are likely to suffer from a no deal Brexit.
He has kept a very low profile on this so far and labour voted against the remain slanted amendment tonight which does make you wonder

[jourdain2]

Re: OP Of the 3 names given, I personally would think that JRM would be best i/c (very cool, clear thinker) - but he's only a backbencher. Gove has a backstab in his history. Boris would probably be the better public bet. Not at all sure about Leadsom - she dropped out of the Leadership challenge pretty quickly, something wrong there, and she has agreed to the Chequers White Paper. Andrea Jenkyns is doing very, very well - but again, very junior.

Perhaps Boris as a figurehead, supported by JRM as Deputy (and actual controller)???

[jourdain2]

PS ichkeria ^^^^ A huge number of Labour constituencies voted Leave - so I think your figures may be suspect. Are you referring to actual members?

[Zacs-Master]

I’m still convinced May will stay until Brexit is done. But we do live in very strange times.

[Hopkirk]

Keep an eye on Gove.

[gulliver1]

Jourdain2, 21.47." perhaps Boris as a figurehead ".
Not sure about that, but I could describe him as a different sort of head. Richard comes to mind.

[cassa333]

As perhaps are you Gulliver!

[Hopkirk]

A while ago Theresa May was asked which way she would vote if asked to now.

She declined to comment.

Jeremy Hunt though did answer. He voted remain, but would now vote leave. (He admitted to being fooled by George Osborne's false warnings)

Does that qualify him as a Leaver?

[cassa333]

I think she will survive till after Brexit. Who wants to be caretaker PM of a poisoned chalice?

JRM is too junior to get to be PM ((but look at what Corbyn was before his sudden and unexpected rise?))

Gove is a backstabber.

Boris the class clown

In all likelihood the majority remain Conservatives wouldn’t elect a leaver. They would be too worried that they talk more sense than people like frothing at the mouth Soubry

[Zacs-Master]

‘In all likelihood the majority remain Conservatives wouldn’t elect a leaver’

You’re getting it now aintcha, Cassa. Loving the poisoned chalice phrase too. Very astute.

[gulliver1]

Which remainer will take charge?.

[Hopkirk]

There's a prominent Leaver who hasn't been suggested here - David Davies.

[Old_Geezer]

If they don't replace with a leaver, and thus be seen to support democracy, they'll be in the same mire, with the same pressures, plus a public knowing that the party doesn't care a fig for their, the public's, opinion.

(Luckily the message to the EU that they just needed to stall long enough to keep control, was defeated tonight. Talk about remainer dirty tricks, fortunately that didn't get through. Still looking as if the no deal option will be forced on all by the EU.)

[Zacs-Master]

‘Still looking as if the no deal option will be forced on all by the EU’

Is it? Where do you glean that nugget from?

[Old_Geezer]

Just looking at the way things go. The EU doesn't want anything apart from their initial position, so anything that doesn't agree won't be accepted. They want that which keeps us in, we must be out or it'll never be done with.

[gulliver1]

Think Boris, and Gove should be put on trial for misleading the public about Brexit , and Cameron should be Locked up , key thrown away, OK. All Richards,

[Zacs-Master]

Well, I was hoping for something logical. Maybe I expect too much.

[Zacs-Master]

Cameron gave us the referendum. Then he quit when he realised the ludicrous (there’s that word again) position he’d put us in. Not sure that’s a jail sentence offence.

[cassa333]

The news I listened to inferred the EU are desperate for a deal because they know a no deal would be disastrous for them. (They don’t care if it is disastrous for us obviously)

Time we went in all guns blazing.

Although not cut and dried they are seeing that there are enough Eurosceptics who know how they work and are trying to do right by the country and the remainer government won’t be able to give too much more away.