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Project Fear Part 16967.8 - Perlease
42 Answers
https:/
Ok that's all the foreign vehicles barred from the UK too, that's about 40/1, who's going to hurt more? NEXT!
Ok that's all the foreign vehicles barred from the UK too, that's about 40/1, who's going to hurt more? NEXT!
Answers
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“You…appear to believe that law enforcement authorities – either in the UK, or Eire or France – would allow people to use their roads with no valid driving licence…”
I don’t believe anything of the sort and you misunderstand my point. What I’m saying is that even without a comprehensive deal, some accommodation will be found to allow UK drivers to drive in the EU and vice versa. At present France (to name but one EU nation) does not require a driver from the USA to hold an IDP. Why would it insist on a UK driver having one?
“…and no valid insurance (a consequence of having no valid licence) and no need to worry if, through negligence or accident, they kill another road user. “
The lack of a driving licence cannot invalidate insurance cover. All UK insurers are bound to provide cover against Third Party injury or damage caused by any vehicle they insure regardless of who is driving it or their licence status (the only exception being if they have been disqualified from driving by a court). This applies even if the vehicle is stolen provided the thief can be identified. This facility applies abroad provided the policy provides cover outside the UK. It will continue after Brexit as it has nothing to do with the EU.
“Rees-Mogg, Johnson and others say the Irish border is not a real problem, claiming it is easy to resolve. They ignore the legal obligations on the UK to abide by international treaties that there will be no hard border.”
The Irish border is a non-issue raised by the EU to extract concessions from the UK. Both the UK and Ireland have stated that they have no intention of imposing a hard border. The EU as an institution has neither the resources nor the authority to do so. So another question needs to be asked: “On 31st March 2019, assuming no deal is in place, who will intercept traffic crossing the Irish border?” The UK has no obligation to impose a border; Ireland has stated that it will not so any sanctions taken against them by the EU for failing to do so will be for them to sort out.
Contrary to what you imply, I am not advocating widespread anarchy in the event that no deal is reached. I’m simply pointing out that pragmatism is far more likely than chaos to prevail.
Yes Jim, it is quite right to point out that (some of) these things could happen. But it's also incumbent on those doing the pointing out to explain how likely or unlikely they are to happen.
I don’t believe anything of the sort and you misunderstand my point. What I’m saying is that even without a comprehensive deal, some accommodation will be found to allow UK drivers to drive in the EU and vice versa. At present France (to name but one EU nation) does not require a driver from the USA to hold an IDP. Why would it insist on a UK driver having one?
“…and no valid insurance (a consequence of having no valid licence) and no need to worry if, through negligence or accident, they kill another road user. “
The lack of a driving licence cannot invalidate insurance cover. All UK insurers are bound to provide cover against Third Party injury or damage caused by any vehicle they insure regardless of who is driving it or their licence status (the only exception being if they have been disqualified from driving by a court). This applies even if the vehicle is stolen provided the thief can be identified. This facility applies abroad provided the policy provides cover outside the UK. It will continue after Brexit as it has nothing to do with the EU.
“Rees-Mogg, Johnson and others say the Irish border is not a real problem, claiming it is easy to resolve. They ignore the legal obligations on the UK to abide by international treaties that there will be no hard border.”
The Irish border is a non-issue raised by the EU to extract concessions from the UK. Both the UK and Ireland have stated that they have no intention of imposing a hard border. The EU as an institution has neither the resources nor the authority to do so. So another question needs to be asked: “On 31st March 2019, assuming no deal is in place, who will intercept traffic crossing the Irish border?” The UK has no obligation to impose a border; Ireland has stated that it will not so any sanctions taken against them by the EU for failing to do so will be for them to sort out.
Contrary to what you imply, I am not advocating widespread anarchy in the event that no deal is reached. I’m simply pointing out that pragmatism is far more likely than chaos to prevail.
Yes Jim, it is quite right to point out that (some of) these things could happen. But it's also incumbent on those doing the pointing out to explain how likely or unlikely they are to happen.
I don't think anyone can feasibly estimate how likely or not any one of these things is to happen; the onus is on the politicians and negotiators on both sides to sort out the details, not on the various companies, experts and agencies to second-guess the outcome of those negotiations.
In the meantime, it's also incumbent on Brexiteers to be honest about just what *could* go wrong, rather than trying to deny the obvious. A "no deal" Brexit, without proper care, would indeed be the equivalent of driving off a cliff and hoping that somehow we don't fall. Saying so is absolutely not "Project Fear".
In the meantime, it's also incumbent on Brexiteers to be honest about just what *could* go wrong, rather than trying to deny the obvious. A "no deal" Brexit, without proper care, would indeed be the equivalent of driving off a cliff and hoping that somehow we don't fall. Saying so is absolutely not "Project Fear".
It also warns that Britons travelling to the EU may need to make sure their passports have six months left to run.
https:/
https:/
This is just one reason they should have been having the right discussions from the start. As said 6 months of how much we pay was far too long.
Every ounce of Brexit effort should be put into sorting these th8ngs out ready for no Brexit and then given to the EU and say. Agree or not? Not, well OK but it hits you as well.
Every ounce of Brexit effort should be put into sorting these th8ngs out ready for no Brexit and then given to the EU and say. Agree or not? Not, well OK but it hits you as well.
I think you meant 'no deal' there, cassa rather than 'no brexit'. How many of 'these th8ngs' do you think there are?
This might give you some idea of the enormity of the problem and the processes involved in sorting them out:
https:/
Driving licenses and the like are really just the minutiae.
This might give you some idea of the enormity of the problem and the processes involved in sorting them out:
https:/
Driving licenses and the like are really just the minutiae.
"n the meantime, it's also incumbent on Brexiteers to be honest about just what *could* go wrong, rather than trying to deny the obvious."
And by the same token the likes of Carney and other remoaners should also balance their fear statements by what positive things 'could' happen with no deal. It is by no means a one way street.
It is the constant dripping of negative information that makes them a joke and very obvious to anyone with half a brain that it is an attempt at scaring people into thinking their way.
And by the same token the likes of Carney and other remoaners should also balance their fear statements by what positive things 'could' happen with no deal. It is by no means a one way street.
It is the constant dripping of negative information that makes them a joke and very obvious to anyone with half a brain that it is an attempt at scaring people into thinking their way.
As far as Brexit goes, in the UK "Establishment" there are only pessimists. I have seen no mention from any of them of the many upsides to Brexit (particularly in the longer term). Only doom, gloom and despondency. It's unsurprising as so few of them actually support the idea but they should get used to the notion that their argument was lost and they now need to crack on and take advantage of the situation instead of treating it as a damage limitation exercise.
Oooh! I thought this thread was dead, and I see Togo tried to imply I was lying about delayed flights.
https:/
I demand an apology!
On a more serious note, I took away from this discussion that even the staunchest leaver accepts that in the case of drivers' licences there needs to be a limited agreement.
I extrapolated to a necessity for similar "limited agreements" on airspace; on automotive parts; on medicines; on food products; on bees for pollination; on cellphone usage; on digital copyright and a thousand other aspects of daily life.
I run a business that relies on digital copyright. There is no agreement. Not even any discussion of agreement on this in the context of Brexit.
If there is no agreement, my business collapses. The taxes I pay; the taxes my employees pay will all evaporate, because with no copyright discipline, anyone can copy the material we put out.
When the people who want to 'Just Leave' are put on the spot with specific detail, their position collapses.
18 months after the article 50 was triggered, there has been no suggestion from the leave brigade about how all these small, detailed matters will be sorted after Brexit.
The draft written a few weeks ago was so full of holes that the promoters withdrew it for fear of ridicule.
There is no workable solution to 'Just leave' It is a pure fantasy.
If you have a different view, tell me how to solve the issue of digital copyright after we leave. Or any one of these fiddly, detailed issues that the Brextremist politicians have all steadfastly avoided answering.
https:/
I demand an apology!
On a more serious note, I took away from this discussion that even the staunchest leaver accepts that in the case of drivers' licences there needs to be a limited agreement.
I extrapolated to a necessity for similar "limited agreements" on airspace; on automotive parts; on medicines; on food products; on bees for pollination; on cellphone usage; on digital copyright and a thousand other aspects of daily life.
I run a business that relies on digital copyright. There is no agreement. Not even any discussion of agreement on this in the context of Brexit.
If there is no agreement, my business collapses. The taxes I pay; the taxes my employees pay will all evaporate, because with no copyright discipline, anyone can copy the material we put out.
When the people who want to 'Just Leave' are put on the spot with specific detail, their position collapses.
18 months after the article 50 was triggered, there has been no suggestion from the leave brigade about how all these small, detailed matters will be sorted after Brexit.
The draft written a few weeks ago was so full of holes that the promoters withdrew it for fear of ridicule.
There is no workable solution to 'Just leave' It is a pure fantasy.
If you have a different view, tell me how to solve the issue of digital copyright after we leave. Or any one of these fiddly, detailed issues that the Brextremist politicians have all steadfastly avoided answering.
//and I see Togo tried to imply I was lying about delayed flights...…...
I demand an apology!// (+_+)
Let's see.
"Anyway, I've been in Munich these last couple of days - have to get out to the airport to catch a flight now, so will not be commenting further for a while."@17.41.Thursday 13th!!
That was after being "pinned" by Judge.
Further post @20.20 Stating that the flight is delayed. Whereupon I wondered aloud whether the "flight" was more a flight from Judge's very accurate post. (after checking on the status of all flights up until midnight on Thursday that were due to leave and finding all were on time or had left on time.)
We then have an "example" given of a delayed flight for Friday scheduled to leave @21.55 Friday which indeed departed @23.16 and landed @0.45 Saturday. Now either there was a little bit of psychic ability displayed, on Thursday, being able to predict a delayed flight 25hours in advance or the journey from Munich to Munich Airport was a very long one indeed. Not only that the post attempting to traduce the observation that a "pending and subsequently delayed flight" was indeed convenient in that it allowed time to concoct a response to an inconveniently pointed post from Judge was made whilst the "delayed" flight was in the air, in fact 9 minutes after take off. Do you concoct the defense for the Russian secret services?
As stated the devil is indeed in the detail. Especially when someone is determined to put it there.
I demand an apology!// (+_+)
Let's see.
"Anyway, I've been in Munich these last couple of days - have to get out to the airport to catch a flight now, so will not be commenting further for a while."@17.41.Thursday 13th!!
That was after being "pinned" by Judge.
Further post @20.20 Stating that the flight is delayed. Whereupon I wondered aloud whether the "flight" was more a flight from Judge's very accurate post. (after checking on the status of all flights up until midnight on Thursday that were due to leave and finding all were on time or had left on time.)
We then have an "example" given of a delayed flight for Friday scheduled to leave @21.55 Friday which indeed departed @23.16 and landed @0.45 Saturday. Now either there was a little bit of psychic ability displayed, on Thursday, being able to predict a delayed flight 25hours in advance or the journey from Munich to Munich Airport was a very long one indeed. Not only that the post attempting to traduce the observation that a "pending and subsequently delayed flight" was indeed convenient in that it allowed time to concoct a response to an inconveniently pointed post from Judge was made whilst the "delayed" flight was in the air, in fact 9 minutes after take off. Do you concoct the defense for the Russian secret services?
As stated the devil is indeed in the detail. Especially when someone is determined to put it there.
Togo
I don't spend time thinking of answers. Butif you want to believe that, it matchs your fantasies about an no-deal Brexit.
Yes, I slipped up and gave the detais of the flight 24 hours later than the one I actually took.
Here is the actual one.
https:/
I'll not be respinding further.
I don't spend time thinking of answers. Butif you want to believe that, it matchs your fantasies about an no-deal Brexit.
Yes, I slipped up and gave the detais of the flight 24 hours later than the one I actually took.
Here is the actual one.
https:/
I'll not be respinding further.
-- answer removed --
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