Nige Quits Ukip

[Jackdaw33]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46448299

[ToraToraTora]

VI: ""He turned them into the most successful party in History" Did not win one single seat in the 2017 election, they won one seat in 2015, yes a very successful party. " - seats are the means that normal parties have achieve there aspirations trying to get things through parliament. NF got his through parliament without ever setting foot in partliament. He induced fear in the the Tories, forced them to hold a referendum and won it. His was the only party in history to achieve 100% of what their manifesto says. Seats in the commons are not the only measure of success.

[jim360]

The thing is, though, that without being in the drivers' seat, has he really achieved what he set out to do? I rather think he hasn't -- and, while I would personally be grateful for that, it rather makes a mockery of this idea that he is a successful politician.

What he is really is a successful heckler. As I say, I suspect that suits him very well, because that way he can claim all of the credit for Brexit and none of the blame for its consequences. He can always insist that he personally would have done a better job because he has the luxury of never being tested on that claim.

*That's* what I mean by my criticism of him earlier.

[ichkeria]

Naomi I was not criticising Farage for “shouting from the sidelines” just making the point that that seems to have been the way of many since the referendum.

[Jackdaw33]

I missed all the removed posts. Was there a common theme?

[Spicerack]

Nothing important, JD. Grammar mistakes.

[steg]

//His was the only party in history to achieve 100% of what their manifesto says//

His party manifesto included voting reform and a lot more, but we still have the same voting system, so I think your wrong

[Spicerack]

^You're. ;-)

[steg]

Cyber kick to the nads for spicey

[ToraToraTora]

"The thing is, though, that without being in the drivers' seat, has he really achieved what he set out to do? " - well many have done their best to thwart it perhaps but at least he has achieved the mandate to do it.

[Atheist]

I think that Nigel feels he is now in a different league from UKIP. He prefers to hang out with Messrs Trump and assorted multi-millionaires, including Russian ones.

[ChillDoubt]

Ha ha, my posts about grammar were removed.
Never mind.
Funny that people get uppity about it online yet if a teacher corrected their child and improved their grammar/spelling they’d be praised for doing a good job.
Little wonder it’s on the decline.

Still, never let your karma run over your dogma.

[ChillDoubt]

Careful Spicerack, you might be joining me on the naughty step for providing free grammar lessons!

[naomi24]

Jim, your deliberation consist mainly of irrelevant criticism – for example Farage’s attendance record as a MEP which has no bearing on Brexit whatsoever – never forgetting your bizarre reproach on his failure (having not been invited) to become actively involved - added to which you appear to make every effort to avoid acknowledging the successes of anyone whose politics don’t concur with yours – Farage included. In observing all of that I have addressed the substance of your posts.

[Canary42]

This guy was a banker in 2008 - 'nuff said.

[gulliver1]

Think Farage ought to be invited to take part in the five days of Debating in the house of commons, he would be very good in taking part in this mass debate.

[ToraToraTora]

perhaps they could borrow the hall in your Village.

[retrocop]

TTT
Always appears to be plenty of empty space there.

[ichkeria]

“UKIP achieved 100% of its manifesto”

I don’t think so. They didn’t even achieve the referendum and leaving the EU bit as only parties in power can to that. They certainly were influential but you cannot achieve anything with a maximum of 2 MPs much as I concede they deserved more MPs for the number of votes they got in 2015.
So, the happiest and most satisfied party ever for about a week in June 2016, maybe :-)

[jim360]

I simply don't see it as Farage's success, at least nowhere near as much I do as Cameron's failure. Put another way, Farage may have been the one shouting the loudest about it, but victory in the referendum for him and his ilk could never have happened were it not for the cockiness and arrogance of Remain MPs and supporters in assuming that victory could come only through fear, or just that they would win inevitably so why bother planning for a "leave" vote?

Most evidence suggests that Farage himself, as well as UKIP, only ever had minority support -- even if you make the most generous assumptions about why UKIP didn't pick up more votes or seats in the 2015 election, it's pretty obvious that there are, and always have been, significantly fewer than 17 million UKIP supporters -- so that you may have to look elsewhere to explain fully the victory for the Leave campaign.

I suppose my final point is that, no matter the politician or the position they hold, it's much easier to convince people that you'd have done a better job if you're never in the position to do so. Considering the number of prominent Leavers who actually *have* been in that position -- and how successful they've been (ie, not at all, by anybody's standards) -- then I find it hard to take seriously the idea that Farage would really have been much better even if he *had* been given a shot. May has failed to get the Brexit you wanted, because that Brexit was impossible to attain, a position that, is essentially the same as Leadsom's, albeit for very different reasons.

[Old_Geezer]

Unsure what was in their manifesto now. Was it just to get the government to hold a referendum ? One must assume so from the number who claim there is no role for the party after getting the referendum. If so... Personally I always figured they were still needed to ensure we got out, but Farage had felt he'd done his bit and passed on the reins to those apparently incapable of continuing it's success. In retrospect, not such a good move.