'Nurses Using Foodbanks Now'

[bobbinwales]

Bbc headline today.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/health-63992959
Well I want them to get abit more than 4% that the pay body come up with but they allready earn more than me and I dont need foodbanks thanks....so 19%...no chance and I don't believe foodbank stories except in exceptional cases like part timer or trainee or someone with big debts

[MissTerious2]

Agree Rowan.

[youngmafbog]

//A huge pay rise would increase recruitment , might even prompt some to return.//

You seem to be deliberately ignoring ( I am sure you are not thick) the fact there is a budget. Higher salaries means less can be employed.

[lankeela]

If a huge pay rise would increase recruitment surely they would be in it just for the money - and that is surely not the reason we want our nursing staff to be in the job.

[choux]

ymb, I never said, nor thought, the workers got that sort of pay. I think most sensible people would realise the agencies are not working altruistically.

[Khandro]

They've got a decent offer on the table but their Communist rabble-rouser of a leader demands 19% --- ludicrous !

[mushroom25]

it's being alleged that ending "non-dom" status would generate enough revenue to pay a 19% pay rise for nurses 3 times over.

can anyone substantiate or refute the claims? none of them have any evidence to get hold of.

[campbellking]

Much as I agree the 19% is excessive, would those who are expressing anti nurses sentiments please suggest what alternatives we can offer when the NHS is haemorrhaging nursing staff and not training enough to replace the leavers? Locally the private sector is offering thousands in sign on bonuses and more benevolent working hours.

[sp1814]

What should nurses do other than striking?

Genuinely curious to hear alternative suggestions.

[sp1814]

Also...isn't it true that public server pay has been failing behind inflation for a few years?

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jul/19/how-public-sector-pay-has-fallen-in-real-terms-in-charts

How do they carry on?

Applause and pan-banging don't pay the rent.

[sp1814]

*service

[maggiebee]

No nurses striking in Scotland. They have settled for a 7.5% pay rise so crisis averted.

[Bazile]

//Applause and pan-banging don't pay the rent.//

It's more than enough for some on here

[bobbinwales]

Its complicated.... paying more should help recruitment and retain staff provided the budgets are increased by goverment, but it wont make much diference unless we start to train more nurses and that'll take years.
Keeping existing staff if turnover is high staff and bringing back retir'd nurses is the answer but am not convinced giving more money would help much... can they really be leaving nursing for better payed jobs or bigger pensions than there earning.... doubt it.
Also maybe there are some nurses tasks that should be done by more junior staff.
May be the answer is for nurses union to accept the pay review body figure for now if goverment also commits an extra bonus of say £500 now (and may be £500 in 12 months) and for the pay review body to be reconvened by the goverment for a new review in 1st Quarter of 2023 to take uptodate account of inflation and a recruitment/retention drive with target's.
There you go.... sorted. Bobb for Health Minister/PM

[Khandro]

sp //What should nurses do other than striking?
Genuinely curious to hear alternative suggestions.//

Accept the offer ?

[bobbinwales]

^ or change there demand to the same as what maggiebee says Scottish nurses settled for?
Even so nurse 'shortages/pressure' will not go away

[sp1814]

Khandro

So if they accept a below inflation pay rise and the NHS continue to find it difficult to attract staff, what then happens to patient care?

What about getting staff from abroad? That seems a bit short-termist and wouldn't resolve the underlying issue.

[campbellking]

Why are the nurses supposed to accept an offer way below inflation (the Pay Review Body recommendation was made before inflation went through the roof)? Universities cannot currently fill their nursing courses as they do not have enough applicants. The PRB award also does not take into account the hike in pension contributions that came in at the same time ( for all of those about to tell us what a fantastic pension this is it is no longer a final salary scheme with a lump sum attached).

[sp1814]

bobbinwales

Some really well thought out ideas there...the problem may come if inflation is still at the same levels in a year as they are now.

Also, whilst inflation is bad now, pay in the public sector has fallen in real terms for over a decade.

Other issue is - if the government caves here, other areas of the public sector will demand the same treatment.

[sp1814]

What about relieving short term recruitment issues by bringing in qualified nurses from the EU?

[bobbinwales]

//Why are the nurses supposed to accept an offer way below inflation (the Pay Review Body recommendation was made before inflation went through the roof)? //

When you sign up to a pay review body you should accept its findings. If inflation had fallen to zero would the nurses really have rejected the offer saying no to 4.3% its too high... of course not.

Any inflation will be took account of next time so they catch up eventually. Maybe a one off bonus could help tide them over or they could get an advance now of say 2% on the following years offer

But maybe the review body could be asked to update its recomendations as I suggested- maybe even set a 2 year deal