When Is This Stupid Going To Stop?

[Bobbisox1]

The CofE are considering taking the word Father from the Lords Prayer

https://news.sky.com/story/god-is-neither-male-nor-female160church-of-england-is-considering-gender-neutral-terms-12805759

[naomi24]

But it can be to do with the current fashion of kowtowing to the ridiculous.

[Atheist]

Naomi; You mean kowtowing to God? :-)

[naomi24]

No. I mean the equally ridiculous.

[andy-hughes]

Given that this is a faith that has not moved on in any meaningful way for two thousand years, and still merely tolerates women in its midst, I can't for one moment see this catching on.

I think it's a wind-up by the terminally attention-seeking gender fascists, and even though they make a vast amount of noise, there is a minuscule number of them compared to the hide-bound faith holders who will not countenance such nonsense for a moment.

[ToraToraTora]

Thanks for the BA bobs!

[DTCwordfan]

and A-men has to go too.....

[Peter Pedant]

Holy Mother of God !

I think you are allowed to say Mutha if you wish....

[DTCwordfan]

so we can't use the word 'farter' now instead of 'father/ - as I wrote in a new version of the Lord's Prayer - and we probably can't use the title either... some over-zealous or religious mod at work? Nothing wrong with a little cynical irony.....

[zebo]

//Holy Mother of God !//

Are we allowed to say Mother though?

[Bobbisox1]

I wondered why the answer removed DT

[naomi24]

zebo, the Catholic church won't be changing that.

[barry1010]

The CofE have been debating this for at least 10 years and I think it will still be debated for another 10 years.
As Christians believe in the Holy Trinity I have no problem with using 'they' instead of 'him' and using 'god' instead of 'father'.

God is very personal to every believer and I am sure my perception of God is different to everyone sitting in my church

[Atheist]

Rev Dr Ian Paul told the Telegraph that any change would represent an abandonment of the Church's own doctrine. He said that it would mean moving the doctrine of the Church away from being "grounded in the scriptures".
I thought that the non-sexual nature of 'God' according to Jews and Christians had been discussed and accepted by their theologians centuries ago. Does anyone here know where to find the relevant bit of C of E doctrine? Does the C of E have doctrine?

[jourdain2]

Well, as a C of E regular attender at church, I simply wouldn't say it. I've no problem in thinking of God by using 'He' as a catch-all because language is not capable of defining the supreme being (that sounds pretentious, sorry, only way I could think of saying it).

Neither will I use a plural personal pronoun to describe a single being or person - it's ungrammatical and I am finding that I abandon more and more books these days because I find the increased usage of 'they' so very off-putting and confusing. Just reading a book by J.R. Ellis (closed room mysteries) whose previous efforts I have thoroughly enjoyed. In it I came across this collection of words - you can't call it a sentence - 'Well, this killer doesn't hang around, do they?' Complete nonsense.

If the C of E does go down this path, then I shall no longer attend church unless they want me to continue playing the organ - and I shall ask to be paid for that.

[bednobs]

it's not ungrammatical to say them or their to describe individuals.

"i asked the children to get ready to go out, and each child got their coat on"

[Atheist]

jourdain2; The use of "they" for a singular is surely quite common, when it is used in relation to an unknown person; e.g. "We don't know who the intruder was, but they must have been pretty nimble to climb that drainpipe."
As an atheist (for all practical purposes, not as a claimer of asbsolute knowledge) it does seem really strange to me that many humans take seriously the idea that 'God' is masculine. Is there any justification for it? To me it seems obvious that it's a simple reflection of the social structures of the times when some old books were put together. Is it really shocking to imagine that a supreme creator should have been feminine - after all, women have a larger role in creating and maintaining new humans than do men. Men simply fertilise the women and it's the women who do the hard long-term work of carrying, bearing and caring. Fortunately many men do their share of child rearing and family feeding, but I don't think that should entitle them to claim all the glory for themselves by identifying 'God' as one of them.

[bednobs]

"Well, this killer doesn't hang around, do they?"
what would you prefer that sentence to say?

[jourdain2]

I'd use 'he' as a catch-all, Bedknobs. All that needs doing is what writers have done for donkey's years, which is to insert a sentence somewhere at the beginning to say 'We'll assume the killer is male, but keep an open mind.' By using 'they' you have to use a plural verb for a singular subject - it just doesn't work. I'd say 'each child put his or her coat on' - except I wouldn't be so clumsy, so I'd write 'the children put their coats on'.
Same with Atheist's example, ' .. the intruder must have been pretty nimble to climb that drainpipe'. It's easy enough to avoid the pronoun problem.