Stokeace why have you gone quiet about your views on immigrants

[ruby27]

Stokeace
In my last post I was questioning the veracity of your post about the immigrants and now you have gone quiet. Is this just a coincidence? By the way I tried google to search out the information you provided but didn't come up with any hits.

[stokeace]

ruby i havent gone quiet i have been out lol.try www.thesentinel.com it was a case on 04/05/07 involving two illegal immigrants and was dealt with by stoke on trent crown court.i hope that you can find this information any apology would be most welcome lol

[ruby27]

I am confused. I have tried www.thesentinel.com but his is the site of a North American Newspaper. Surely you are not expecting me to find a write up of court hearing in Stoke in the newspaper. (or am I missing something)
My question was did you know this story to be true - that you sat or stood in the court room, not that it was an ill founded whisper which occurs in Stoke on Trent in respect of immigrants. You haven't answered that yet, surely I do not need to apologise for asking a question I thought that was the purpose of AB. I will certainly apologise when I see that I have been at fault/committed an error.

[stokeace]

so are you saying what happens in stoke on trent crown court a figment of my imagination?of course i wasnt present in court i read about it in the local press along with about a quarter of a million other inhabitants of stoke on trent.tif you would like me to e mail you the page i will gladly do so or try googling staffordshire news and go to the sentinel website.

[ruby27]

Did I say it was a figment of your imagination - no. What I asked was could you actually verify that this had occurred and was not at the Guardian reporter an ill founded whisper circulating in Stoke about immigrants. Please do not tell me you believe everything you read in Newspapers. It may well be true but the conviction of 2 immigrants who were working and not being subsided by the state is hardly supporting your claims of waves of immigrants coming to this county using up scarce resources so that the NHS and other welfare institutions are brought to their knees, so that British (or is it only white British) are failing to get services that they have paid for through their working lives. Ps what about non working white British should they be allowed health care etc when they haven�t paid NI?

[stokeace]

ruby i can assure you its not a whisper circulating in stoke on trent im not going to engage in an argument in what happens in the area where i live.of course the immigrant issue is a strain on all our resources ie housing,the nhs there is only so many immigrants a country can take in and help and im sure that the uk has taken in and helped more than our fair share..

[THECORBYLOON]

This is the link, http://www.thesentinel.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?n odeId=158338&command=displayContent&sourceNode =158321&contentPK=17230331&moduleName=Internal Search&formname=sidebarsearch

[ruby27]

Thank you thecorbyloon. For entering into this thread. I do like accuracy even if this makes me a pedant. Stokeace you were accurate in your posting, however this still doesn't convince me that immigrants, Muslim or whatever are some sort of drain on the state, rather it shows that these two people were rather enterprising to obtain documents that enabled them gainful employment. It kinda reminds me of the Great Escape film where the people were terribly ingenious.
Ps thecorbyloon are you from Norhtampthshire Scotland or am I completely of the mark

[stokeace]

thank you corbyloon now ruby does that put your mind at rest?how can you say that immigrants like these are not a drain on society?there are half a million illegal immigrants in this country that constitutes a massive discrepency in unpaid taxes and ni contributions.how are they enterprising to obtain false documentation and fraudently stay here when they had been denied permission?they are criminals and they got their just deserts.being enterprising is coming here with nothing gaining permission to stay here being law abiding citizens and contributing to the economy.now seeing as you think most people in stoke on trent are of caveman intelligence and racist i am now going to gather all my neanderthral friends and go on a racist tirade outside the local mosque now that is how you like to percieve us here in staffordshire isnt it.based on the keele university report that is.im sorry to dissapoint you but we arent like that actually.thank you once again corbyloon.

[jno]

most people complain about immigrants living off social security. These ones got jobs and worked to support themselves and families and increased the nation's GDP. Such wicked behaviour; they should be locked up.... so now they're living at the taxpayers' expense in jail? Exactly how is that better for anyone than the position before they were arrested?

[vehelpfulguy]

jno, most of us in this coutry try to obey the law. We have legal documents and pay our taxes.

These people came here illegally, had false passports and other false documents.

The facilities in this country (schooling, NHS, libraries etc) have been paid for by all of us over many years and are not the right of anyone who just fancies coming here.

We are not a charity and have the right to pick and choose who we accept into this country.

I am fed up with this country seen as a soft touch for anyone who think they have a right to be here just because they managed to pay somone to smuggle them into the country.

[vehelpfulguy]

Also, for every illegal immigrant who comes here and DOES get a job and contribute you get others, like this person, who screws us into the ground:

http://www.thisisthurrock.co.uk/display.var.10 73911.0.jailed_illegal_immigrant_bought_400_00 0_home.php

[stokeace]

come on ruby its YOU HAVE GONE QUIET NOW maybe im not the racist you thought i was judging by vhgs postings its not just me who is sick of illegals being here and taking us to the cleaners.............

[jno]

my question still remains: how are things better, for us, them or the country, now these guys are in jail? They've shown a willingness to work, which a great many people (and I don't just mean immigrants) do not; surely the sensible thing would be to get them into the system and tax them? Meanwhile, who's making the pottery now?

[stokeace]

the sensible thing was for them to have been deported and your sarcastic question does not even merit an answer.

[jno]

that wasn't a sarcastic question but an economic one, stokeace. Immigrants typically work for the lowest wages, not just in the pottery sector. If they are removed from the system, then either they are not replaced and production goes down - meaning less pottery is available, so prices go up - or they are replaced by locals who demand higher wages - which also means prices go up. Worst-case scenario is that people stop buying pottery because it costs too much and the company closes down, throwing people - local and otherwise - out of work and on to the dole. Who on earth benefits from that? The truth is that immigrants who are prepared to work usually end up doing the low-paid, dirty jobs - because the locals don't want to do them. (How could the NHS manage without employing foreigners? It couldn't, in my opinion.) So I say: get as many immigrants as you can who show a willingness to work, and get them into the tax system as soon as possible.

[rosie posie]

oh hello , i feel a little out of my depth here,as i dont really know the ins and outs of the all this imigrant stuff,,,however,i will say were i live we have lots of polish people ,and i must say they are very hard working people,trying to make ends meet as we all do.i cant fault them for that and i find them very pleasant people.. i dont begrudge them that...however...i cant get my head round the young youths that i see every saturday...BRITISH youths causing mahem,swearing,violance,disrespect...example..21 yr old saying to a young girl and her grandmother,,get your tits out,,,i work in a shop were i see all this going on ..theres many more storys to tell what i have wittnessed, and my heart breaks ,because i dont know what to do for the youth of todays society,,god wats happening.the polish are are maybe used to not much...were as the british youth,,,and before every one starts,,not all british youth..are used to having it a nanny state,they take what they cant be arsed to work for,cos there are no consequenses..i could go on aaallll niitteee ..on and on and on and on

[Reverandfunk]

Just to say if people come here legally, work, pay their taxes, obey the law etc etc I have no problem with that. What I do have a problem with is an immigrant family being given priority over me when it comes to housing. I'm single, male, work, pay tax but will the council house me? NO. If I leave my job tomorrow will I be able to claim benefits? NO. Someone arrives here under the pretence of "asylum", speaks little or no english and has nothing to offer and is just going to be a constant drain of money and they are clothed, fed and housed.

I would appreciate any of the do gooders on here to justify how this is right.

[sp1814]

The question of tax may be a red herring.

Illegal immigrants generally work in such low paying industries, that even if<i/> they were 'legal', it's questionable as to whether they would earn enough to actually pay much to the Exchequer anyway, despite the lowest level being �5,225 per year.

[NJOK]

Rev, didn't you make exactly the same point on another thread recently?

You don't need a council house, mate. You're single and you have a job. Why are you getting grumpy about missing out on something you don't need? Save your bitterness up for something important.

You might as well get annoyed at not being able to park in disabled parking space. They're not for you. They for people who need them. Or are you also seething at those wheelchaired b*stards who get to park right near the door at Tesco?

Incidentally, we don't give asylum to people because we think they have something to 'offer'. We give asylum to people because we're a civilised country that believes in helping those in need. And proud of it.

[johnlambert]

But they are not illegal NJOK, they usualy turn up and announce in a clear loud voice "I an a citizen of ..... and I claim political asylum" . They are then offered shelter and limited benefits until their case is heard, thus making them legal immigrants.