British families should be first in the housing queue not immigrants

[AB Asks]

Labour minister Margaret Hodge says British families should be given council housing ahead of immigrants. She said it was unfair that new arrivals jumped to front of the queue leaving no homes for British families. Hodge caused controversy last year by saying that Labour had failed to deal with immigration or provide affordable housing which in turn prompted the traditional-working class voters to move to BNP. What do you think? Are Hodge's claims true?

[anotheoldgit]

I think that Britain has a proud and honourable tradition of helping those who need shelter.

I see the fact that people run to Britain as a badge of honour. That we can provide a safe haven for those who need it most is a reminder of what is best about our society.

The strong have a duty to help the weak

All very impressive utopian views bigmalc, but we are now a very small over crowded Island and there has to come a time when for our own peoples sake we say enough is enough, let someone else who has a much larger land mass bare the brunt. If one has a small house you cannot keep producing children, you have to call a halt or move into a larger house, this is commonsense.

Our whole infrastructure is falling down around our heads, far too many people for our Health Service, Schools, Housing, utilities and Roads. We have all seen the extra burdens placed on the NHS, the difficulty in teaching children who's cannot speak English, not enough housing for the indigenous population even, shortage of water in some areas during dry spells, and more people means more vehicles causing congestion which results in the need for more roads or the easier option of road charges. Cannot you left-wing, do-gooders see all this?

How long before we are also weak? And who will help us then?

[anotheoldgit]

One question I would like to ask bigmalc, ruby27, Goodsoulette and others like them.

If you had a spare room in your house and one of your family and also a stranger turned up homeless asking for accommodation who would you give the room to?

I say house these immigrants in ex-military camps, they were good enough for us when we were serving our country, so why shouldn't they be good enough for them?

[Marvelman]

Well said aog.

[Goodsoulette]

How can you possibly compare giving a spare room in your house to a family or a stranger to giving a council house to an immigrant or a british family? For starters I would assume both the british family and the immigrant family would both be strangers to those allocating the house!

I dont think housing immigrants in military camps is an awful idea as long as their are provisions for them to better themselves through working. I have a polish friend who works as a bus driver during the day mon to fri, in a restaurant every night bar one and at starbucks during the day at weekends. I cant name one British person that works as hard as he does. If he had a family I would not resent him having a council house one bit.

[NJOK]

Goodsoulette,

He often attempts the house/country analogy. It never quite works.

[Supernick]

Population density figures. We're 48th in the world. I would say we have space and infrastructure to support immigration for a while

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries _by_population_density

More Asylum stats than you could ever want. Worth noting that in 2005 there were 25,725 applications. 15,685 asylum seekers were removed in the same year. Fill your boots.

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs06/asylum q206.pdf

Immigration stats - 427,000 approved people over 2 years from May '04 -June '06. That's 213,500 per year. (+18,000 dependents per year). I think that they're currentlt filling a gap in the market. Things will change in future when we don't have the work to support everyone.

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/about-us/news/imm igration-statistics-05

What do asylum seekers receive? Seems like just enough to keep people going, but not allow them to die on our streets. Seems reasonable to me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/actionnetwork/A215178 5#3

Enjoy.

[anotheoldgit]

No good quoting home office figures to me, they just do not know how many people are in this country.

And to quote the left-wing BBC is another matter.

You still have not given me an answer your family or a stranger? It does not work because you don't like the answer. Charity begins at home.

[stokeace]

exactly aog they come into this country get benefits.free nhs treatment.houses and our own are left out.illegal immigrants even had the nerve to march in london the other week the police should have moved in and arrested them all and interred the lot of them then deported them we are too soft in this country at the expense of the needy of this country........

[Supernick]

Illegal immigrants is completely off topic. This thread has nothing to do with them. Lumping together illegal immigration, legal immigration and asylum seekers is what causes so much resentment. I think we'd all agree that an illegal east Euopean gangster is wildly different to a US businessman who has relocated to our country and has a job.

If you are a legal immigrant to this country then you should have the same rights as everyone else in my opinion. If we had what you considered to be a well managed and presumably low level immigration policy, would you still be advocating giving them fewer housing rights and benefits than a citizen born in the UK?

[Supernick]

And to answer the house/country analogy.

No I wouldn't give my spare room up to a total stranger without question. But the analogy doesn't work. I might as well shrink it further than you and ask if you would share a bath with your family member or stranger? Neither? Then you can't be an advocate of allowing ANYONE housing in the country.

[Goodsoulette]

lol...nick you sure you wouldnt have a bath with your great aunt?

[Supernick]

Have you put cameras up???

I've a third question. Are there any stats that I could ever produce that would be accepted. If the government and media can't be trusted (yeah, yeah) then I presume there is no source that I could ever find that would be considered true or correct?

[joko]

bigmalc - firstly i don't read either of those papers - my views are my own - if you can't accept some people have differing opinions without arrogantly assuming they must be brainwashed, that is your problem.

and i don't hate anyone either - grow up - foot stamping and wild accusations have no place on a discussion board

secondly, i might have known i would be picked up on a minor irrelevancy - of course they do checks!!
did you honsetly think i meant they just stroll on through??
do i really need to spell every single little thing that i mean out for you to get the gist and to stop you jumping on minor issues?

the point is - how do they prove it? how do they check?
what evidence is there?

if you are in fear of your life so much so you may leave the country it is likely the police are not involved so theres no paper trail of incidents - just your word.

come on tell me how it is proven and checked?

they can make up all sort of incidents and reasons, and there is no way to verify it... or are you suggesting only people with plenty of evidence are accepted?

and what evidence would that be?

[Goodsoulette]

I went to school with dome Yugoslavian (sp) refugees. The local church provided them with accommodation in Taunton, the girls did very well, both accepted at Oxford and I know Anna has gone back to home town. I think most people have a problem with immigrants who are non-white, well at least that has been my experience anyway ( and Joko I am certainly not classing you as one of these, as I happen to think you are far more intelligent and liberal than most who disagree with immigration policies). Are people really moaning about the Australians, South Africans, Italians, French and Spanish who wish to live and work here.

[stokeace]

NO supernick so you are saying that if a legal immigrant has been here for a year should get the same housing and benefit rights as someone who has paid into the system for say 35 years.where is the fairness in that?its because of people like you who advocate this sort of system that there is so much resentment.people who get granted citizenship should NOT get automatic rights until they have paid enough into the system through taxation and national insurance contributions then and only then should they be allowed access to the nhs,housing etc etc.

[Supernick]

Correct Stokeace. You should have the same rights whether you have paid in for 50 years or 1 year. We don't deal out rights based on length of service.

[kwicky]

Why not tackle this problem from another angle. There are immigrants who come to earn easy money probably not paying their tax dues and sending the cash home so not benefitting this country one jot, but just taking. Not so many years ago there was a limit you were allowed to take out of the country. Then why not re-introduce this rule so that money earnt here has to be spent here.

[ruby27]

Trying to stick to the original post
No I don't agree with Margaret Hodge, I believe it should be based on need
Do I think if this is the policy of the government will this lead to an increased voting towards BNP?
No I think anyone who is prepared to take such an extreme and fundamentalist perspective as voting and supporting BNP is not going to be receptive to any perspective that challenges their view and will filter all information to support their bigotry
Last post as this is just repeating what has been said before.

[joko]

thank you goodsoulette.

I just wish we had the resources to look after anyone who needs it...but we just don't, and i do feel that ''charity'' begins at home, and only when the people of this country are being looked after, can we start to look after other countries.

i understand that for genuine asylum seekers who are genuinely fleeing for their lives, must be a terrible life and i don't blame them for one minute for wanting to leave, but every genuine one there are lots of fakes, anf the sytem is being abused

[Oneeyedvic]

stokeace"so you are saying that if a legal immigrant has been here for a year should get the same housing and benefit rights as someone who has paid into the system for say 35 years.where is the fairness in that?

So presumably you don't want council houses to go to people who doesn't work / has not paid into the system and you certainly don't want council houses to go to single mothers who get pregnant at 18. Also guessing that you don't want people who have been injured to have health care if they have not paid into the system and heaven forbid if a child should go sick (especially if his parent(s) are on the dole).

By your analogy of working for 35 years, I am guessing that you only want council houses / healthcare to go to people over 50.