Listener 4127

[Ruthrobin]

Has no one started a thread? Is it because people are a little bit disappointed with this one? Perhaps there is some clever twist that I haven't seen.

[Clamzy]

Too true The Bear69, I'd still be solving if the method of entry hadn't come to my aid.
I've understood the 2 groups' thematic words and the associated phrase which exactly describes the entry method, but have only the first part of the title and am beavering away at the second two.

[tilbee]

Working on that basis my suggested title is "....mightier tham the sword"

[TheBear69]

Clamzy, look at the last two words of the phrase, not just the last.

[Stavrolex]

Finally got the title. Duh! By the way, does anyone know when last year's stats are being published - thought it was usually around the beginning of March (?). I can still convince myself that I was all correct until the envelope arrives.

[starwalker]

Stavrolex - annual statistics are normally available after the annual Listener Dinner, which I believe is next weekend.

[perseverer]

Stavrolex - when you don't get an invite to the annual dinner, you know you're not all correct!

[freiheid]

I was misled by TRAIL-OIL, which almost fits 2d as a normal clue (if you bend the definitions a bit). But I'm still struggling to parse 3d. I quite enjoyed the puzzle! I thought the clueing was good.

[freiheid]

I meant TRAIN-OIL...

[bellabee]

3d - 7 letter word for union / 4 letter word for 'a single time' replaced by adult. [the rest is the def]

[bellabee]

we seem to be in a minority of 2 regarding the clueing.

[TheBear69]

I do not think there have been more than a few, if any, negative comments about the clueing (except for the one of the theme ones where it is debatable that the entry is really "without definition"). I think the clues are quite good.

[freiheid]

Thanks, Bellabee, it all makes sense now;) (I was fixated on the idea of castigation)

[bellabee]

minority of 3 then.

[bellabee]

yes freiheid,several clues were cleverly misleading i thought, and there were a couple of near &lits it seemed to me - these i took to be the strength, not the weakness, of the clueing - i think thebear69 has missed some very negative comments about the clueing [and a chorus of dittos].

[Clamzy]

I think I missed them too, but agree with your assessment earlier in the thread that some clues were (by Listener standards) very easy, but quite a few were toughies. Some of the answers were words new to me also. All in all I didn't find the grid fill very easy.
That's a fearsome looking avatar Bear69.

[bellabee]

my earlier assessment was a response to earlier comments - 'just a race between solving the clues or getting the answers from wordwizard' - 'very humdrum clues' - 'snap' ....and i think the general tone of the thread after that suggested agreement. i think working out the clues was probably the best part of this crossword [and that was spoilt in part by the very easy clues] but the endgame didn't really work for me, so i shouldn't say much more about it really.

[IainGrace]

Have to say we are struggling with this one. We get the idea from posts that it is not difficult or particularly interesting, but have thus far solved just over half the down clues (none of which lack a definition) and only half a dozen across clues, without any thoughts as to the pattern of across grid entries. Must have expended too much brainpower last week.

[trux]

bellabee - actually I agree that some of the clues were really very good, especially the Acrosses (I liked 12A, 32A, 41A, 42A - even 34A) but, at same time, there were perhaps too many overly simple anagrams amongst the Downs (6D, 17D, 20D, 35D) ... That said, I have been trying to help out with some clues recently on another puzzle, and, by gum, is it difficult to do ... so one should admire these efforts almost every week, mefeels.

[bellabee]

i agree entirely trux - [but would just like to add acrosses 15,21,27 + 30 to your list of goods if i may?]

[Philoctetes]

This was not a perfect Listener - that would involve hard but rational clueing, with several layers of PDM leading to a glorious, unexpected climax. But I do think we tend to be distracted by the endgames into thinking that they are what makes a great puzzle. This one does lean too much towards being a straight clueing task, but, as has been said, the clues are up to it, giving rise to many an appreciative chuckle.