Why Do You Believe The 'Holy Bible' Needs Splanin'...

[mibn2cweus]

...for those who believe there is any?

If 'God' sought communication with his 'creation', why a book? Why does this book require countless revision, reinterpretation, and translation? Why wouldn't you expect more from an alleged 'creator of the universe', a direct means of communication for those who seek to do so?
Anticipating (based on undeviating past experience) what will follow in this thread, God's apparent need for a middle man to facilitate, translate, interpret and explain His communications leaves much to be desired. But never mind all that, splain away.

[Theland]

https://biblehub.com/john/20-28.htm

Jesus recognised as God.

[andy-hughes]

That is not really very convincing Theland, unless it suits you to believe it.

Obviously it suits you, and not me.

[vulcan42]

Theland that is such a weak argument. The statement could have been changed in the translation. He could just as easily said, "My Lord, oh my God!". ( Just recently I met somebody I hadn't seen for years, his first words were "Oh my God you've aged"). Do you think he thought I was his God?.

[Atheist]

Apparently the first words my father uttered when he saw me were, "Oh my God!" (presumably because I was exceptionally beautiful).

[HansUrbancka]

To follow up on what others have said :-

Oh my God Theland, is that the best you can do ; bearing in mind that the Gospel of John was Not deemed to have been written until over 50 years after the death of Jesus

If my words are read in a thousand years hence, perhaps your name will be synonymous with the Almighty.

Hans.

[Theland]

The risen Jesus is the most powerful argument of all.

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // The risen Jesus is the most powerful argument of all. //

As I said - if it suits you to believe it, it's a powerful argument, if you choose not to believe it, it is no argument at all.

[Theland]

Andy - All my beliefs are founded on evidence, otherwise it would be a blind faith, and that would not suit me at all.

[HansUrbancka]

Theland...What is the proof that Jesus rose from the dead, or even died on the cross.?

Hans.

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // Andy - All my beliefs are founded on evidence, otherwise it would be a blind faith, and that would not suit me at all. //

If by 'evidence' you mean your constantly trumpeted fulfilment of 'predictions' in the bible, that's a matter of interpretation, and that is not the same thing as evidence.

A prediction can be twisted and turned to suit any argument you like - evidence is fact, and cannot be twisted at all.

[Theland]

No, scholars who have spent their careers studying the bible as history, have left us with some facts to mull over.
Some of these scholars like Bart Erhman, are agnostic but agree on some common facts.
Jesus was real.
He was crucified.
The tomb was empty.

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // No, scholars who have spent their careers studying the bible as history, have left us with some facts to mull over.
Some of these scholars like Bart Erhman, are agnostic but agree on some common facts.
Jesus was real.
He was crucified.
The tomb was empty. //

I feel like a broken record here -

Just because an academic believes something doesn't make it true.

You have constantly been in thrall to just about anyone with a suit and a reasonably appealing speaking voice who will get up in front of a camera and tell you this, or that is a 'fact' and it's 'real'.

It simply makes it what you believe, and not a fact, and as I have pointed out endless of times, the two are not compatible.

If I put on a suit and film myself saying that the moon is made of green cheese, I can find a sizeable number of people who will agree with me, simply because I put it on the internet.

But that is no basis for a belief system - especially not one that utterly governs your life, as yours does.

[Theland]

So do you completely discount ancient history, after it has been well researched?
We talk with confidence about Julius Caesar, Aristotle, Socrates, Plato, the Egyptian Phaeros etc.

[Mozz71]

//Jesus was real.
He was crucified.
The tomb was empty//

None of these suggest that he was the son of God though. He was just just his era's version of David Icke. I'm sure there were plenty of thieves around in those days who had no qualms about looting a crypt.

[Theland]

Nothing I ever say will convince you.

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // So do you completely discount ancient history, after it has been well researched?
We talk with confidence about Julius Caesar, Aristotle, Socrates, Plato, the Egyptian Phaeros etc. //

And the So Rule enters the thread!!!

No I do not 'completely discount ancient history' - which is probably why I did not say that I do.

You cannot compare these people with Jesus - their writings and exploits are a matter of proven history.

The 'evidence' of Jesus is so sketchy that even four gospel writers can't agree on it - but then, since they started years after his death, why would they.

Add to that the simple fact that all your 'examples' are proven historical figures, but no-one worships then as deities and sons of God - so they are hardly rock solid comparisons, are they?

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // Nothing I ever say will convince you. //

But acknowledging that has never, and probably will never stop you from trying.

That's the difference between you and most atheists - they (and I) are not remotely bothered if you accept our inability to believe in your God - but you are on a daily mission to convince everyone that your belief system is the only correct one.

If God is that bothered about saving me as a sinner - and the bible claims he is - then he can shift himself and give me a little evidence, instead of assuming the arrogance of expecting my belief based on an ancient book.

[Theland]

Yes, He's leaving it to you.

[naomi24]

Theland, //The risen Jesus is the most powerful argument of all.//

But was Jesus ‘risen’? What if he didn’t die on the cross? Both logic and experience of life dictate that the dead don’t return to life and the story of the crucifixion contains enough information to suggest that Jesus could well have survived. It was a crucifixion like no other. Personally, I think there were a few back-handers flying around between Jesus' friends and the Roman soldiers.

Incidentally, there is a tomb in India reputed to be his. I think it possible.

[andy-hughes]

But you don't know that Theland, you just think it.

I think Alicia Dixon is a goddess - doesn't mean she is one, just in my mind.