Kids today.

[123everton]

The other week a teacher attacked a pupil in the classroom almost(?) kiling him and injuring two others. I don't know the full details of the incident (I can only speculate) but I have many a time had to deal with violently anti-social children and this sort of behaviour is not unusua elsewhere. But, is it not a first, that when the accused appeared in court ex pupils (little older than the victim) turned up in court to offer their moral support to him? What does this tell us about our country today? Does it begin to show us that the many (majority) of good teenagers and younger children are sick to death of the antics of the scumbags, and are we as adults failing them by refusing to deal with the problem more effectively?

[jake-the-peg]

Well that's one way of looking at it and I guess the way you would if you wanted to deliberately paint a "Hell in a handbag" picture.

You could just as easilly paint a picture that the majority of the kids that turned up to support him in court shows that most kids are supportive of authority figures.

There have always been a minority of trouble makers and there always will be.

When I was growing up in the 80's it was football hooliganism - do you remember that?

What happened to the weekly violence and running battles with other supporters and the police with gangs of kids?

Before that we had mods and rockers, teddy boys the original "Yobs" were victorians with wide belts they used as weapons.

There's nothing new here.

Only a mentally disturbed man who returned to work too early and tried to kill someone who was disrespecting him!

[123everton]

But JTP, the notion that there's always been crime is a given.
The fact that there have been violent robbers throughout time immemorial is a given.
The other examples you give were social groups who looked to fight each other, with the exception of football hooliganism which occaisonly targetted innocent people.
It's the randomness, casualness and persistence of violence that rankles now, I see daily an under current of aggression with large numbers of people.
The fact is, that some members from the victims own peer group were more than sympathetic to the alleged offenders actions.
That is (to my mind) unusual but (perversely(?)) I find it encouraging that a section of our youth are wanting to show their disgust at anti-social behaviour.

[naomi24]

I don't believe that anti-social behaviour is exclusively the domain of the young, but it is more prevalent in our society now. We hear reports of idiotic attacks on ambulance and fire crews, or on doctors, nurses and teachers (and bus crews!), and we are confronted daily with notices telling us that anti-social behaviour will not be tolerated, so that must now be seen as a necessity. The majority of young people do have good principles, but I think many who don't, learn their lack of respect for anyone or anything from the attitude of their parents, who are without doubt, failing them. I hope the tide is turning.

[Ankou]

when i was growing up we had gangs of skinheads roaming the streets looking for people to duff up. this was of course lampooned by passmore and brains in tuckers luck, but where i lived it was quite random, quite unprovoked and quite real.

[jake-the-peg]

I'm not convinced that anti-social behaviour has increased either.

Why do you think that?

Because you see it more in the newspapers and on TV shows like Jeremy Kyle?

And everton, you've simply dismissed a major source of violence in the 80's (" the exception of with...") You can't just ignore factors that don't fit your agument.

Football violence was huge 25 years ago.

Violent crime is down nearly 20 percent over the last 10 years. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1360561 /Eighty-year-crime-rise-is-reversed.html

That's not an opinion based on anacdotal evidence that's a fact.

Maybe it's up where you live - I don't know but if so that's just an example of the dangers of making generalisations from your own experience

[keyplus90]

Before blaming the kids of today I would blame the adults who have brought up these kids. Role model thing in other words. Majority of the adults today do not have anything to teach the young ones apart from what they already have taught and the results are there.

[naomi24]

Jake, It isn�t a fact. The survey you offer is based on information gathered from 9000 people and measures household experiences rather than offences recorded by the police. As such, it is misleading. In fact the article ends with a statement that the most recent police figures show an increase in violent crime. Having said that, not all anti social behaviour equates to violent crime - much of it is simply unpleasant and intimidating, but I think quite a lot of it is overlooked or excused, and goes unreported.

[tigerlelly]

I gave up teaching after many years because you only need a couple of bad apples in the class to completely disrupt a lesson and every term the bad apples were increasing in number.
I had a good rapport with most of my students, excellent exam. results and enjoyed my job for many years but last year I found myself dreading the very thought of going into the classroom and was horrified to find myself actually fantasising about murdering one of the worst-behaved pupils. So.....time to go. I have never been happier and most of my ex-colleagues have never been more miserable. I can understand how a teacher (even one without mental problems) could snap.
I don't advocate bringing back the cane but a little support from parents and officials wouldn't go amiss.

[123everton]

Tigerlelly, I said on a different thread that it's been coming, I sympathise and I understand. There just seems to be an added edge to their antics these days.
Things have deteriorated, I'm 20 years on the buses and things have gotten much worse in that time.
I actually agree with Naomi many of the incidents in work for myself and others go unreported because despite the threats they amounted to nothing in the end.
The point I'm trying to make is that their own peer groups are reacting against them now, and that is a departure.
As for football hooliganism, I used to watch Everton home and away 25 years ago, I'm not excusing the violence but it was mainly targetted at other fans.
Sometimes they picked on people who had nothing to do with the fighting, but a lot of footy violence is organised and arranged at a set venue.
Even back in the day, the away supporters who wanted a fight would "take over" (flag in the window etc) a local pub and just wait for their crews to arrive.

[naomi24]

The point I'm trying to make is that their own peer groups are reacting against them now, and that is a departure.

I hope you're right, Everton - I really do.