ChatterBank6 mins ago
Question For Keyplus
61 Answers
I honestly dont mean this in any derogatory or offensive way (and I hope other ABers dont turn this into such a thread as its a serious question)
But as a muslim, how would you tackle the issue of muslim extremists killing innocent 'westerners'...Tunisia, 7/7 etc?
What is the general view of muslims concerning these issues?
Thanks in advance and please dont let this question slide into personal attacks.
But as a muslim, how would you tackle the issue of muslim extremists killing innocent 'westerners'...Tunisia, 7/7 etc?
What is the general view of muslims concerning these issues?
Thanks in advance and please dont let this question slide into personal attacks.
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A lot to think about and digest there...(from both keyplus and other ABers, thanks to all)
First of all I havnt managed to view any video links yet because unlike other ABers I am not on broadband. I'm on a top up dongle and still have to use use public computers to view you tube clips as they chew up my data at an alarming rate :-(
I'm going to get shot down in flames here from other ABers but I'm not entirely convinced by 'official' reports concerning 9/11 (and the pentagon attack) because of the following reasons...
1) Ive piloted an aircraft. It takes a great deal of skill to fly even a 2 seater Cessna and months of training to get a license for such a small plane
2) It takes YEARS of training to become competant to fly a jetliner. Anybody with a small aircraft license could NEVER fly a commercial jetliner, never mind direct it in to a building. (Clanad would be useful here to verify....or deny...the above)
Now with that out of the way...(if conspiricy theories can ever be out of the way) There has been reports of muslims that are local to my home town (stoke on trent) been charged and convicted of been involved with extremist islamic groups. (no airplane license or conspiriacy involved). These people were NOT in any way associated or linked to mossad or CIA, only to local muslim communities. (if it walks like a duck...)
//he says that Muslims come to the west not for a better life but to show us the way, he believes that eventually Islam will rule, and he would like to see the flag of Islam flying over Downing Street//
If that is the case I will have to say that I'm quiet happy the way I am, I have no desire to become a muslim and find the idea of a muslim flag over Downing St aborrhent. Ive known several lovely muslims in the course of my life and am quiet content to live and let live but I have no intention of been coerced into a belief system that is alien to me and demands my subservientcy, especially through force (it wouldnt then be an honest conversion anyway).
Sorry for the spelling and grammar mistakes, Had a long day today helping some friends out with a bit of DIY and going jump in the bath right now but thanks again to all for replies. Will pick up on it again tomorrow.
Thanks keyplus and other ABers.
(P.S....it might be a post for another day, but I really cannot believe anything I read/hear in the news after some experiences some years ago where I knew as a fact that what was reported (nationally) was a croc of cra* as I was there at the time)
First of all I havnt managed to view any video links yet because unlike other ABers I am not on broadband. I'm on a top up dongle and still have to use use public computers to view you tube clips as they chew up my data at an alarming rate :-(
I'm going to get shot down in flames here from other ABers but I'm not entirely convinced by 'official' reports concerning 9/11 (and the pentagon attack) because of the following reasons...
1) Ive piloted an aircraft. It takes a great deal of skill to fly even a 2 seater Cessna and months of training to get a license for such a small plane
2) It takes YEARS of training to become competant to fly a jetliner. Anybody with a small aircraft license could NEVER fly a commercial jetliner, never mind direct it in to a building. (Clanad would be useful here to verify....or deny...the above)
Now with that out of the way...(if conspiricy theories can ever be out of the way) There has been reports of muslims that are local to my home town (stoke on trent) been charged and convicted of been involved with extremist islamic groups. (no airplane license or conspiriacy involved). These people were NOT in any way associated or linked to mossad or CIA, only to local muslim communities. (if it walks like a duck...)
//he says that Muslims come to the west not for a better life but to show us the way, he believes that eventually Islam will rule, and he would like to see the flag of Islam flying over Downing Street//
If that is the case I will have to say that I'm quiet happy the way I am, I have no desire to become a muslim and find the idea of a muslim flag over Downing St aborrhent. Ive known several lovely muslims in the course of my life and am quiet content to live and let live but I have no intention of been coerced into a belief system that is alien to me and demands my subservientcy, especially through force (it wouldnt then be an honest conversion anyway).
Sorry for the spelling and grammar mistakes, Had a long day today helping some friends out with a bit of DIY and going jump in the bath right now but thanks again to all for replies. Will pick up on it again tomorrow.
Thanks keyplus and other ABers.
(P.S....it might be a post for another day, but I really cannot believe anything I read/hear in the news after some experiences some years ago where I knew as a fact that what was reported (nationally) was a croc of cra* as I was there at the time)
-- answer removed --
Keyplus, I don’t quote people out of context.
Your words:
//As far as the domination of Islam is concerned. Truth always come out on top, sooner or later. You believe it or not. Your problem//
//Islamic domination- Yes Islam (real Islam) will dominate the world one day as that is the only perfect way of life whether you agree with it or you don’t. A huge number of people accepting and entering into Islam at a time when the propaganda against Islam is at the highest is the clear evidence of the practicality of its teachings. But before that Muslims will have to act upon Islam the way it should be acted upon instead of trying to copy the different systems in the world that have clearly been a failure.//
//All you have to do is what I have advised you so many times before. Make sure you tell children in your family (especially females) all about how Islam treats women before they come and inform you about their decision to convert to Islam. And don’t be fool thinking it will never happen to you because it is happening around you.//
Your words:
//As far as the domination of Islam is concerned. Truth always come out on top, sooner or later. You believe it or not. Your problem//
//Islamic domination- Yes Islam (real Islam) will dominate the world one day as that is the only perfect way of life whether you agree with it or you don’t. A huge number of people accepting and entering into Islam at a time when the propaganda against Islam is at the highest is the clear evidence of the practicality of its teachings. But before that Muslims will have to act upon Islam the way it should be acted upon instead of trying to copy the different systems in the world that have clearly been a failure.//
//All you have to do is what I have advised you so many times before. Make sure you tell children in your family (especially females) all about how Islam treats women before they come and inform you about their decision to convert to Islam. And don’t be fool thinking it will never happen to you because it is happening around you.//
I don’t save threads because I don’t say what I regret later and I stick to my words. I remember in that thread I said that if tomorrow Muslims become majority in this country and then according to Democracy (your preferred system) they vote and Islam rules here then what problem would you have with that? After all in a democratic system majority has the right to make decisions. Am I right or wrong?
But at that time I had forgotten that Western countries only like democracy where it suits them and they can favour dictatorship if that suits in the given situation. Otherwise why USA & Co would not accept Hamas’s elected govt as legitimate? Why an elected president Mohamed Morsi would end up in prison through the hands of an Army general backed by USA only because he announced that they would bring the law in their country that they prefer. Do you have an answer to that?
Your problem is that you have a narrow view of Islam through a handful website. And you can’t digest that there are people out there who can see as well accept “Real Islam” I mentioned there. I am Muslims because I believe it to be better than any other religion or no religion in your case. And here is another example.
https:/
But at that time I had forgotten that Western countries only like democracy where it suits them and they can favour dictatorship if that suits in the given situation. Otherwise why USA & Co would not accept Hamas’s elected govt as legitimate? Why an elected president Mohamed Morsi would end up in prison through the hands of an Army general backed by USA only because he announced that they would bring the law in their country that they prefer. Do you have an answer to that?
Your problem is that you have a narrow view of Islam through a handful website. And you can’t digest that there are people out there who can see as well accept “Real Islam” I mentioned there. I am Muslims because I believe it to be better than any other religion or no religion in your case. And here is another example.
https:/
Keyplus, //I don’t say what I regret later and I stick to my words.//
But you don’t stick to your words – at least not openly. In an attempt to deceive the reader you subsequently post words from other people that contradict your previous statements. I told you, Keyplus, you’ve said too much in the past to pretend otherwise – and if you’re not careful, with the introduction of the subject of democracy – something that Islam doesn’t support - you’ll dig yourself in even deeper. And the video. I wonder if that woman who so wants to be part of Islam agrees with you that nine year old girls are mature enough to be married? Perhaps sentimentality got the better of her and she hasn’t really thought about the realities of Islam, eh?
But you don’t stick to your words – at least not openly. In an attempt to deceive the reader you subsequently post words from other people that contradict your previous statements. I told you, Keyplus, you’ve said too much in the past to pretend otherwise – and if you’re not careful, with the introduction of the subject of democracy – something that Islam doesn’t support - you’ll dig yourself in even deeper. And the video. I wonder if that woman who so wants to be part of Islam agrees with you that nine year old girls are mature enough to be married? Perhaps sentimentality got the better of her and she hasn’t really thought about the realities of Islam, eh?
@naillit
//I'm going to get shot down in flames here from other ABers //
Check 6!
dag-a-dag-a-dagga!!
//but I'm not entirely convinced by 'official' reports concerning 9/11//
You are in a not-very-exclusive club of millions, sadly.
When I am in the mood to be unkind, I refer to it as attention-seeking; the "hey, everybody, listen to meeeeeee, I've got it all worked out. Don't listen to those squares" (by which they mean the PD, FD, professional air crash investigators, building engineers, those who produced the archived photos of incompetently applied spraycrete around the girders, etc).
// (and the pentagon attack) //
A bit cruise-missile-y, you think?
//because of the following reasons...
1) Ive piloted an aircraft. It takes a great deal of skill to fly even a 2 seater Cessna and months of training to get a license for such a small plane//
It's a piece of **ss, in MS Flight Simulator. Recent versions of which, I gather, are used in flight schools as a way of saving the pupil the expense of fuel and rental while they perform repetitive exercises.
Before you tell me it's unrealistic or "a game", remember that you are not disagreeing with me, you are disagreeing with the professional pilots whose names are in the credits, who endorse the realism.
Furthermore, there are flightschools in Florida and California who promise to get you in the air and FAA-licenced inside two weeks.
// 2) It takes YEARS of training to become competant to fly a jetliner.//
I know you don't watch BBC, which is why you will not be aware that the Documentary about Virgin Atlantic cabin staff showed some elements of the pilot training program. They reach co-pilot status in as little as a year but, yes, they do accumulate experience on the job, over a period of years.
// Anybody with a small aircraft license could NEVER fly a commercial jetliner,//
Every commercial jetliner pilot begins their career in a small aircraft.
// never mind direct it in to a building. (Clanad would be useful here to verify....or deny...the above)//
Leave the autopilot engaged and twiddle the heading, speed and altitude knobs and you're there. Frighteningly easy.
Messing with the FMS, I'll grant, is another matter entirely. I never bought the payware addon (for FS9) which simulates this in great detail. Both the original software and the freeware FMS I used simulated only route planning, not the actual button presses, so I would be defeated by the real thing.
For one or two years, the Krypton Factor TV show would throw the contestants into an ILS landing approach simulation with zero or minimal rehearsal time. It was the only time I thought "that's unfair". At least, in the sim, you don't have to make your mistakes in front of an audience. Eventually, it becomes second nature and it becomes a leisure activity, albeit a challenging, sometimes nerve wracking one.
Anyway, they went to the States, they learnt in small aircraft at one of these "learn in your vacation" flight schools, they made creepy remarks like "don't concern yourself with teaching me the landings", they moved to the NY area. They had ample time to sit at a computer with a Flight Sim on it, learning how to work the autopilot, learning how to recognise the geography from the cockpit perspective, learning navigation by the instruments, if need be. Ample time. The security services surveilled them but didn't know -when- they were going to go ahead.
I find the conventional explanation entirely believable. I'll get back to you about the Pentagon thing after I've had a think.
//I'm going to get shot down in flames here from other ABers //
Check 6!
dag-a-dag-a-dagga!!
//but I'm not entirely convinced by 'official' reports concerning 9/11//
You are in a not-very-exclusive club of millions, sadly.
When I am in the mood to be unkind, I refer to it as attention-seeking; the "hey, everybody, listen to meeeeeee, I've got it all worked out. Don't listen to those squares" (by which they mean the PD, FD, professional air crash investigators, building engineers, those who produced the archived photos of incompetently applied spraycrete around the girders, etc).
// (and the pentagon attack) //
A bit cruise-missile-y, you think?
//because of the following reasons...
1) Ive piloted an aircraft. It takes a great deal of skill to fly even a 2 seater Cessna and months of training to get a license for such a small plane//
It's a piece of **ss, in MS Flight Simulator. Recent versions of which, I gather, are used in flight schools as a way of saving the pupil the expense of fuel and rental while they perform repetitive exercises.
Before you tell me it's unrealistic or "a game", remember that you are not disagreeing with me, you are disagreeing with the professional pilots whose names are in the credits, who endorse the realism.
Furthermore, there are flightschools in Florida and California who promise to get you in the air and FAA-licenced inside two weeks.
// 2) It takes YEARS of training to become competant to fly a jetliner.//
I know you don't watch BBC, which is why you will not be aware that the Documentary about Virgin Atlantic cabin staff showed some elements of the pilot training program. They reach co-pilot status in as little as a year but, yes, they do accumulate experience on the job, over a period of years.
// Anybody with a small aircraft license could NEVER fly a commercial jetliner,//
Every commercial jetliner pilot begins their career in a small aircraft.
// never mind direct it in to a building. (Clanad would be useful here to verify....or deny...the above)//
Leave the autopilot engaged and twiddle the heading, speed and altitude knobs and you're there. Frighteningly easy.
Messing with the FMS, I'll grant, is another matter entirely. I never bought the payware addon (for FS9) which simulates this in great detail. Both the original software and the freeware FMS I used simulated only route planning, not the actual button presses, so I would be defeated by the real thing.
For one or two years, the Krypton Factor TV show would throw the contestants into an ILS landing approach simulation with zero or minimal rehearsal time. It was the only time I thought "that's unfair". At least, in the sim, you don't have to make your mistakes in front of an audience. Eventually, it becomes second nature and it becomes a leisure activity, albeit a challenging, sometimes nerve wracking one.
Anyway, they went to the States, they learnt in small aircraft at one of these "learn in your vacation" flight schools, they made creepy remarks like "don't concern yourself with teaching me the landings", they moved to the NY area. They had ample time to sit at a computer with a Flight Sim on it, learning how to work the autopilot, learning how to recognise the geography from the cockpit perspective, learning navigation by the instruments, if need be. Ample time. The security services surveilled them but didn't know -when- they were going to go ahead.
I find the conventional explanation entirely believable. I'll get back to you about the Pentagon thing after I've had a think.
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