Did Jesus Exist

[nailit]

Was going to post on Lonnies thread below but didnt want to hijack his thread.
When discussing jesus with christians they always use the 'trilemma' argument...that Jesus must have been either Lord, liar or lunatic (a C.S.Lewis concept I think) I always respond that they are missing another option...legend.
I see no good reason to suppose that Jesus ever existed. The 'evidence' for a historical Jesus is at best scant and at worse non existant. The gospel stories read as an obvious retelling of ancient dying and resurrecting saviour gods. If read literally they make no sense at all but if read as the myth that they were intended to be then they can be read in a different light.
(by myth I mean as the ancients would have used the word...a story to convey deeper truths and not to be taken literally)
Thoughts?

[jno]

yes, I think he did. Why would anyone invent him, when they could just as easily be him? Clearly, some of the tales attached to him are ancient myths; but his actual preaching is fairly specific. Judea seems to have been full of prophets; I think he was one of them.

[Patsy33]

Yes. There is evidence Jesus existed. The Jewish historian Josephus for one who acknowledged him.

[nailit]

The Josephus quotes are widely believed to be forgeries
http://jesusneverexisted.com/josephus-etal.html

[hc4361]

Why would Christians say that Jesus must have been a lord, liar or lunatic?

[nailit]

hc,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis%27s_trilemma

[Khandro]

Yes, Jesus did exist, though I believe he survived crucifixion and eventually died in India.
Why does it concern you - are you a Christian?

[nailit]

No Im not a christian. Im an ex christian. Im not 'concerned', just interested.

[Khandro]

There are for sure a few anomalies in the gospels, but you have to understand what the gospels are, they are discussed here;
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/story/gospels.html
by several wise men in a Q. and A. format

[naomi24]

In truth we don't know if Jesus existed or not but legend has sometimes been proven to have emanated from fact and I think this is one of those instances. People tend to make of the gospel stories what they will, but Jesus (if he existed) was a human being and a Jew. He was never 'Christian' and founding a new religion wasn't part of his agenda. As far as his death is concerned, I agree with Khandro in that I don't believe he died on the cross, and it is possible, although by no means certain of course, that he spent the rest of his life in India, or at least somewhere other than the land of his birth which, in the circumstances, wouldn’t have been an option for him. There exists in India a tomb that some people believe to be his final resting place. Khandro, I think is one of them. Personally, I prefer to say I don’t know.

[-Talbot-]

I couldn't say one way or the other but I wish he and his dad didn't exist.

[nailit]

naomi //There exists in India a tomb that some people believe to be his final resting place.//
I read a book many years ago called 'jesus died in Kashmir' Cant now recall much of the book, have you read it?

[mikey4444]

History tells he did exist, but that same history didn't tell us that he was the son of God.

Today is the Feast of the Epiphany, the date on which Herod is supposed to have ordered the killing of all young male children in the vicinity of Bethlehem.

Yet history makes no mention of this anywhere !

History is the key here, not belief.

[naomi24]

nailit, I've read quite a bit on the subject so it's likely. I also read a book that Khandro recommended, but I can't remember its title off the top of my head.

[naomi24]

Nailit, I think the title of the book that Khandro recommended was 'Jesus lived in India', by Holger Kersten. I've just spotted that one on my shelf. As I recall it was interesting - until the author got rather too carried away with his theories for my liking.

[nailit]

Thanks naomi, will check it out. This is the one I was thinking about
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Jesus-Died-Kashmir-Tribes-Israel/dp/0860330419
Not that I believe it but it was one of the books I came across as a young christian that made me start to question what I was been told in church.

[naomi24]

Thanks Nailit.

[Khandro]

naomi refers to this;
Amazon.co.uk User Recommendation

[Baldric]

///History tells he did exist///

How do you verify that history, or do you just accept that because someone wrote it, it must be true?

[naomi24]

Precisely, Baldric. Actually history doesn't tell that he existed. If it did, the question wouldn't arise.

[Jackdaw33]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacitus_on_Christ