Hubble Telescope

[Theland]

NASA has announced it is thirty years since the Hubble telescope was launched.
It has revealed the true wonders of the universe.
Brings to mind Psalm 19.

[Theland]

Never - Was there a Cause?

[Neveracrossword]

Theland, I don't know and have never claimed to know. My ignorance of the subject is irrelevant. I am not spreading - or attempting to spread - misinformation every chance I get.

[naomi24]

Theland, //I really do understand proof, and evidence, and logic//

And you possess none of any of them. You regurgitate this same old stuff over and over but the bottom line is you don't know.

[Zacs-Master]

Which begs the question.....Who’s dafter?

[tomus42]

I'm not even convinced Theland has any kind of faith.

[Theland]

Naomi - I don't know the universe had a beginning and therefore a Cause?
And of course as devils advocate it is imperative that you take such a stand. Yes?

[Theland]

Tomus42 What you are convinced of is not my concern.

[Theland]

Never - I'm not in that business either.

[Theland]

Zacs - Obviously in your opinion not you.

[jim360]

I think we can all agree that this thread was a great way to ruin an otherwise remarkable subject.

[tomus42]

To be fair to Theland, at least he raised the subject of Hubble.

[Theland]

Jim 360 - Ruin an otherwise remarkable subject?
How so?
By facing facts head on?
As you see from the responses I get, the wages of sin is derision.
Look at Naomi's dismissive comments, which are typical of her responses. Never a single idea or suggestion of her own, and how dare anybody have an insight that she does not share in.
A friendly and serious conversation is foregone in the interests of light entertainment and popcorn moments.
I have not ducked any uncomfortable facts, so please dont suggest
I have ruined anything.
I'm p!eased to continue provided the conversation is friendly and comments are not personal.

[Theland]

tomus42 - I am as fascinated as anybody else in what Hubble, and indeed all of science reveals about the universe.
Sadly, so many scientists are constrained in their thinking, to the extent that they will only consider possible causes of the universe, from within the created universe itself.
In other words, the effect, that is, the universe, is its own cause.
Makes you dizzy doesn't it?

[Theland]

Two examples. Watson of DNA double helix fame, and astronomer Sir Fred Hoy!e, both came to the conclusion that the fine tuning of the universe, was such mathematical improbability, that both decided that a designer, a miracle was required.
But, their scientific straight jackets forbade either of them from considering any cause for life on Earth other than from within the universe.
And so both suggested that an alien race had seeded the Earth in the distant past.
It makes you laugh doesn't it?

Another interesting claim came from Stephen Hawking, who said as long as there is gravity, the universe will create itself.

And what is gravity but the bending of spacetime by the presence of mass.
So as far as Hawking was concerned, there had to be a few ingredients thrown into the mix, that he could not exp!ain, but dear God, don't mention God.

[beso]

Theland. Example of scientists unable to comprehend how the conditions came about for the Universe to exist does not constitute evidence for creation by a god.

Until you can explain how your God (the most complex thing possible in the Universe) could have just always existed, your claims are utterly absurd.

[Neveracrossword]

Theland, 'I'm not in the business of that [spreading misinformation]either' is simply not true. I have lost count of the number of your 'facts' that are simply assertions, your claims that simply don't hold up, your cast-iron links to the Bible which turn out to be tenuous...
'

[pixie374]

An eternal "god" is a cop-out as a cause. You may as well just say "magic". Neither explain anything. Why is this under Religion?

[naomi24]

Theland, //Never a single idea or suggestion of her own, and how dare anybody have an insight that she does not share in.//

No suggestions from me. I’m happy to say I don’t know because, like everyone else, I don’t. And you don’t have an ‘insight’. You know no more than anyone else - and considerably less than many.

[Mozz71]

Oh Lord, it's hard to be hubble.

[Theland]

Beso, how can I, a mere mortal and created being, explain any of the attributes of God? If I could, God wouldn't be God.
The notion is absurd.
Eternity is not an unknown conceptual idea, prior to 1929 the universe was thought to be eternal.