Jews to Christians

[4GS]

When did Christianity become a religion in it's own right?
The first Christians would have been born into Judaism so did they declare themselves split from that religion and become the first Christians, or did they see themselves as a scet of Judaism that gradually become Christianity?
TIA

[Goodsoulette]

The church of JErusalem was set up shortly after Jesus death and was attended by people who were previously Jewish but this is considered the first christian church. Within the nect hundred years there was a pope in Rome, gospels were being written.

There are quite a few accounts of this and they all suggest that CHristianity started as a Jewish sect.

[4GS]

Cheers Goodsoulette,
that's roughly what I thought, I wondered if it became a religion in it's own right after the Jewish rebellion/massada killings circa AD70

[Skreecheeboy]

Jesus ordained his disciples into the church at Pentecost after his death. You can find out about it in the book of Acts in the bible. Basically the house was filled with fire and the disciples were given the gift of tongues and were thus able to spread the message across language barriers.

[Goodsoulette]

They were known as Jewish Christians, I think, Skreech.

[Skreecheeboy]

Is that translated from the Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek or Latin? Surely as soon as they started spreading the message of Christianity they became Christians, doesn't matter what they were before, they started baptising people into Christianity and the first churhes were formed all over the place. Corinth, Ephesia, Thessalonia, Damascus etc. Paul wrote to them all before he died, see corinthians 1 and 2, thessalonians, Ephesians, Romans etc. they were all written to the first churches, and there are probably more that my brain is struggling to remember....

[Goodsoulette]

Yeah, I agree but lets say Catholics, started following something a little different and then that becanme a religion of its own. It would still have been a christian denomination for some time. The time scale involved was of course quite short but it was 300 years or so before Christianity became a countries main religion and that was either old Eritrea (whatever it was called) or Armenia.

[Lonnie]

Hi John,
The sect of Christianity was basically started by Paul and Barnabus, before them, all believers in Jesus as the risen God were Jews,
As you can imagine, that caused a few rifts, to put it mildly, These early Jewish Christians, and that includes converts, had to obey all the Jewish laws, Kosha eating etc, and because of this, not too many people converted, so Paul said it was Gods wish that believers could eat whatever they wanted, coupled with the fact that Jesus was also called Christ, you have the beginnings of Christianity.

As an aside to this, its believed by some, that Jesus, whilst alive, belonged to a Jewish sect called the Essnes, which again, some think was the forerunner of Christianity.

[chakka35]

Yes, Lonnie has the basic idea. If the gospels are to be believed Jesus was a Jew who preached Judaeism to Jews, and, of course, his God was strictly a Jewish god.

After Paul first mooted the Jesus concept in the mid-50s he also promoted the idea that posthumous followers of Jesus need not be, or have to become, Jews. This was disputed by the Jerusalem Church, the supposed remnants of the supposed lifetime followers of Jesus, who wanted to keep the memory of Jesus solely Jewish.

The dispute lasted for centuries until the newly-converted Emperor Constantine convened the First Council of Nicea in 325 and metaphorically bashed the disputants' heads together and told them to sort it out.

The Pauline version won, and so, one might say, Christianity was born as a religion separate from Judaeism, with the Nicean Creed setting out definitive Christian dogmas. Ironically, those dogmas, anathema to a Jew, would have shocked Jesus!

To someone like me, who is quite satisfied that the whole Jesus story is fantasy anyway, it's all very interesting but not important.

[4GS]

Thank you Lonnie and chakka, you both gave very informative answers as usual
Lonnie, I was in Israel a couple of years ago, and visited the museum which houses the Dead Sea scolls and asked if Jesus was mentioned but the reply I got was that they wern't sure, however, as you suggest, if Jesus was an member of the Essnes sect, then surely they would have writen abiut Him, hence my question last month:

http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Society-and-Cul ture/Religion-and-Spirituality/Question463980. html

[naomi24]

I agree with Chakka for the most part, except that I do believe the historical Jesus existed, but not as the son of God - simply as a man. In my opinion Jesus, a devout Jew, would not only have been shocked - he'd have been absolutely appalled to see what men have created in his name.

[chakka35]

Well said, naomi.

[naomi24]

Thank you Chakka - and ditto.

[reception]

naomi24
what is your real name i think I know you:

[Theland]

reception - Asking for details like that is like the cyber equivalent of stalking. Don't do it.