Your punishment, and God.

[Lonnie]

I'm having a field day here at the moment,

http://www3.hants.gov.uk/museum/curtis-museum/ alton-history/fanny-adams.htm

If the above story was to happen today, in Britain, (non Brits please answer also), what punishment do you reckon he'd get?,

What, if you had the power, would you recomend, and for people of the religious persuasion, where would God fit into it?.

Many thanks.

[keyplus90]

Nice to hear Naomi that you would believe someone who would tell you about the fulfilment of their prayers by God.

Why God gives pain? Good question. My faith tells me that pain, disease, loss, and other things like that are there to wash your minor sins away and a reason to remember God again. Because human often go astray when they have no worries and have prosperity. I have not seen many people talking about God in a night club whereas in hospital many would be praying to God . Yes if God want someone to die in sleep then he can do that and of course not all people suffer before dieing. I know as usual you would not agree with me and you do not have to. But what I am saying is that not every one looks at disease and pain same way.

[naomi24]

Read my post again. I didn't say that.

[naomi24]

Lonnie, the fact that he no longer appears to be around, doesn't seem strange to me. Although I believe the being the bible talks about wasn't a figment of man's imagination, I don't believe he was God, and therefore after all these years, he probably is dead.

I'm convinced that the real 'God', if there is one, is so much bigger than him. He or it is pure love, and love doesn't demand adoration, or threaten people with terrible 'justice' - in fact it isn't concerned with humans at all. We cannot, and shouldn't, even attempt to endow this spirit of the universe with human traits, as the God of the bible clearly possessed, but I believe it is possible to connect with it quietly, through our own spirit, and although he or it takes no interest in us whatsoever, this quiet connection can help is to find our own answers and our own peace of mind. To find God, and hence peace, we have to look much further and far deeper than religious texts and man-made dogma. The real spirit of 'God' is within us.

[MsEVP]

Beautifully said, Naomi !!! I`d give you stars if I could.

[MsEVP]

Lonnie: Will this satisfy your sense of injustice? How about the Law of Karma (Justice)? This says that any current situation is the result of past good or bad deeds. The human soul evolves continuously according to karma through many physical lives to become progressively purer, ultimately to unify with the Supreme Being. The three monotheistic religions you mentioned, all talk about it: Christianity: whatsoever a man soweth that also shall he reap. Judaism: ..sow in righteousness, reap in mercy: Islam: (Koran 2:104). The Bhagavad Gita (Hinduism) : this body is called the Field, because men sow seeds of action in it and reap their fruits. Reincarnation is the spiritual evolution of all souls. God has no need to intervene.

[naomi24]

Thanks Tina. Wanders off twinkling. :o)

[MsEVP]

Long may you twinkle, Naomi! Now perhaps you can also tell me how to do the italics bit?

[naomi24]

Before the bit you want in italics, type < i > (with no spaces between), and after you've finished with italics type < / i > (with no spaces between).

Same for bold. Start < b > and end < / b > (with no spaces between).

I've had to do spaces, otherwise I would have ended up with my words in italics and bold, and no explanation!

Try it, and to make sure it's worked, click preview before you submit.

[Lonnie]

Apologies for not getting back sooner.

Yes naomi, I can fully accept what you say, the way you put it there's not many who would disagree.

MsEVP, I know of that law, but I don't agree with it.
Thanks anyway.

[naomi24]

Lonnie, the Abrahamic religions, with their horrendous God, are often ingrained into people from an early age, and along with that comes the inbuilt fear and the superstition. It all becomes a normal part of their lives, it becomes the way they think, the way they live, and hence it's difficult, and often impossible, for them to remove themselves from it to look at the wider picture. Indeed they're usually too afraid to even begin to think differently.

Can I ask you a question, Lonnie? Have you been to Israel?

[MsEVP]

Thanks, Lonnie, that`s honest and thank you Naomi , see what I can >/b> do!

[MsEVP]

Or not!

[Lonnie]

Yes naomi, but not for some years, (can't get away) I have relations all over the country, from my mothers side.
Can I ask, why do you ask?.

I can only agree in part with your last, in my experience, in Israel at least, your description fits mainly the Frums, most of the others, will, even though they worship and go to the 'Wall', will bend as and when it suits, i've seen it.

[naomi24]

Nice try, Tina. I think you got one of your little triangle things the wrong way round. Bet you're impressed with my technical jargon, though. :o)

Lonnie, I asked because I wondered what you 'felt' there? Do you find it a spiritual place? I'll tell you now, I don't. I think it's one of the saddest places on earth.

[MsEVP]

Naomi, of course I was impressed, but it`s no more than we expect of a wordsmith such as you.

Also, quite an impact your last sentence `saddest place on earth`. Are you going to elaborate on that one day, or not. I can tell you that I lived in Egypt for 2 years when I was quite a bit younger and I never felt one day sad there, just a sense of history, especially in the valley of the kings.
Off to Nod now, bye

[naomi24]

Lonnie, to come back to the question of people being unable to remove themselves mentally from this God. I know people bend - and that applies to followers of all three Abrahamic religions - but the point I was making was that because of the lifetime of indoctrination they experience, they find it impossible to remove themselves completely from the dogma of their religion and to look at life from a different perspective. Even if they bend a little to suit their own circumstances, the influence of religion remains with them throughout their lives, and they remain in awe, and afraid, of this obscure God. I don't believe they are capable of contemplating the notion that their God no longer exists - and that when he did, he wasn't what they say he is.

[naomi24]

Tina, I know Egypt pretty well - but it's nothing like Israel. Here we have an uneasy, sad scrap of mostly inhospitable land where conflict is very evident and mistrust, rife - and it's all down to religion. If there never had been a 'Promised Land', it would probably have been very different. What a trouble-maker this God was.

[Lonnie]

Thats very honest of you naomi, but I wouldn't expect anything else from you.

What I think of Israel..

According to the Bible/Torah whatever, God gave the land to the refugees from Egypt, not forgetting that the land was already owned by a people, ans since then, its probably the most fought over bit of retail estate in the world.

As to who should it belong to, to whoever possesses it at the time, because neither the Arabs or Jews are the original owners. (but neither are the inhabitants of Egypt, that was also taken by conquest)

Lets face it, the whole of the Middle East, since the beginning of time, has been a hotbed of wars.

As for the people, in present times, 20th and 21st Century, I do believe they have a right to be there, or do they?, (twice promised land)

Youve aked a question that I think (for me), can only be answered in a thread a lot longer than this,
Now you've got me going, a new thread is asked for, i'll put it up later tonight.

[naomi24]

Thank you Lonnie. I suppose the same could be said for many lands. Places have been invaded and captured throughout history - but those lands weren't 'promised', and that's the difference.