Ricky Gervais on being an atheist . . . .

[mariner2]

He was asked what happens if it turns out he's wrong and there is a God after all?
He replied "well for a start he'll forgive me, and anyway it's his fault for making me an atheist"
Flippant remark, or a pretty good bit of reasoning?

[Mr Veritas]

If there IS A god,and I don't believe there is; he must have created the idea of Aethism.
I am an Aethist so I am just carrying out gods wishes.
If being an Aethist is wrong,and was god invented,then it's gods fault,and as Ricky said he will forgive me.
If Aethism (on the other hand) is a creation of the devil,then god will forgive me because I was deleuded and misguided.
However,as god does not exist,I am not worried about the above.

[mibn2cweus]

If the Good Lord really wanted us to believe in Him then surely He would not have bestowed upon us the capacity to reason?

[Mr Veritas]

To add you to your answer mibn2cweus,
If there is a god he would aslo not have given us the facility to NOT believe in him?

[mibn2cweus]

. . . or made not believing in Him essential to our continued survival, well-being and growth.

[keyplus90]

Or God may say that why did you not think about it and looked around you? And why did you not use your brain and the ability to ponder about the Universe? If I had to come and stand right in front of you and only then would you have believed in me then there had been so many people in the history who declared themselves gods so why did you not believe in them.

Finally God may say that it’s not me who made you atheist it was your own choice out of so many choices you had. Had you said just once even in the isolation (if you were embarrassed admitting in front of others) "Oh God few people say you are there but I have my doubts so if you are out there then show me the right path" then I would have shown you the right path but once again you made a mistake by thinking that you knew more than others did. But unfortunately your choice was wrong.

[kawakiri]

He/she doesn't have to forgive.

[A.Guest]

. . . and Ricky Gervais is a nonentity.

[birdie1971]

Let me get this straight...

God gives you the ability to form your own opinions – including the ability to question His existence - and then He punishes you for questioning His existence?

And if you question His existence, you go to Hell.


So logically, God must know that some people will question His existence (as He is omnipotent) therefore He must want some people to go to Hell. However, God could stop people from doubting His existence by merely wishing it so. But He apparently choses not to.


Ergo, God wants some people to go to Hell.


What sort of demonic, barbaric, monstrosity wants to punish a person beyond their own flesh and blood? To punish a person beyond their physical being, to a metaphysical state and punish that entity for ever and ever and ever...

Only barbaric human minds could have come up with something so wicked as the concept of Hell.


God does not exist. Neither does Hell.

[Davethedog]

Thing that always confuses me about religion is if there was a god (which there isn't)
there can only be one religion the right one.

Now every follower believes they are right, so what happens to all of those people who believe in the "wrong" religion come judgement day?

[keyplus90]

Birdie's logic that if God had to save everyone then why did he not do so. For that God has angels as they have no free will to do whatever they want to, So no free will means no freedom to choose, and no freedom to choose means no punishment either.

Now for the human, God has given you free will to choose, but he is not forcing you to choose what you are choosing, Of course being a creator only he (and no one else) knows what you would choose. In simple words he as a creator PREDICTS what you would choose even after having all the information but by no means that is equal to saying that he made you do that. If you imagine my little birdie right now you do have a choice and you are making that choice and no one is forcing you. Or is there anyone who is forcing you to believe that there is no God where other people around you believe there is? As for punishment if you drive at 90miles in a 70miles zone and still do not want to be punished then what mistakes the others have done who also could have enjoyed themselves at 90miles but the decided o abide by the law. At least in this case if God want to forgive you as he is forgiving then I have no problem with that.

cont:

[keyplus90]

Someone gave an example, that there were three kids in one class and teacher predicted on the basis of their ability to follow teacher's lectures that A will pass as he is paying attention to lectures, B may pass as sometimes he pays attention and C will fail as he has other things on his mind. After when result comes that happens. Now would you blame teachers for that? Or would you say teacher did that or would you say he predicted that.

Dave’s question is very good. And I always say to answer this question that every single major religion’s scriptures talk about ONLY ONE GOD. And in Quran God clearly says that “Ask believers of the other religions to come to the common terms among us and that is worship ONLY ONE God”. Dave my brother that is the starting point and for that people should act upon THEIR OWN religion and it would be first step to solve the problem you pointed.

[birdie1971]

Hi Keyplus.

Your above answer is a really good attempt at applying logic to a thorny question. I applaud you for your efforts.

However, you've overlooked one very crucial point – you don't seem to understand logical argument and as such your argument doesn't hold any water.

You attempt to dismiss the claim that God can chose to save everyone but doesn't do so by saying, “For that God has angels as they have no free will to do whatever they want to, So no free will means no freedom to choose, and no freedom to choose means no punishment either.”

If I'm understanding you correctly, what you are suggesting is that God CAN save everyone but chooses to leave that choice up to His angels. These angels (according to you) have no free will. Despite that fact that God could bestow free will upon them just as easily as He has given it to humans. Therefore, He has chosen not to. Correct?

I freely admit that I'm not altogether sure what your first paragraph is trying to say. Maybe you could elaborate?

[birdie1971]

Continued...

Next you suggest that the words “know” and “predict” have the same meaning. They do not. I can predict the weather tomorrow but I certainly do not know what the weather will be like. “... In simple words he as a creator PREDICTS what you would choose...”.

No He does not. He KNOWS what you will do. He's knows because He is infallible. If He's not infallible, He's not God.

Which returns us to my original point.

God knows what each and every one of us will do. He does not predict as predictions suggest uncertainty and if there's one thing that God cannot be, it's uncertain. If God is uncertain then He does not know the future. If God doesn't know the future then He is not omnipotent. If He is not omnipotent – He is not God.

God must want some people to go he Hell. If He didn't, he could do one of two things. He could delete Hell from existence, therefore removing the possibility that anyone could go there or he could stop letting humans have free will (as you claim He has done to the angels).

Either way, God could stop people from going to Hell if He chose to do so.

[flobadob]

The thing is if I turn out to be wrong and there is a god, well I've been a good guy in general so if he turns round and sends me to hell just cos of not believing in him then he's the kind of petty person I'd rather not be associating with anyway. Good riddance to him.

[birdie1971]

Flobadob – The very idea that Hell exists elegantly demonstrates that God is a pretty unsavoury character.