English "national Anthem"

[jeffa]

Am I the only person who cringes whenever they hear Jerusalem being used as the English National Anthem? Jingoism at is absolute colonial, imperial worst, IMO. Praising your nation is one thing, but suggesting that Jesus actually visited it really is ridiculous! It always reminds me of the episode of Till Death Us Do Part where Alf Garnett is claiming that everything and everyone is English, including God.

[factor-fiction]

The choice seems a little inappropriate to me given the situation in Israel/Palestine= although I know it's not about Jerusalem as such

[inksplotter]

Yes, Jerusalem seems to be strange place to imitate. But then again we hold up Henry VIII as a role model, Julius Caesar, Cleopatra, the list goes on...

[Quizmonster]

CJP, 'Land of Hope and Glory' has been used as England's 'anthem' on occasions such as the Commonwealth Games, when an athlete's success has to be marked specifically in a way to show his/her Englishness as opposed to Scottishness, Welshness or Northern Irishness...not to mention Australianness and so forth!
However, the 'land' in the original version referred to ALL of Britain and not just to England. It was, after all, a line in the 'Coronation Ode' written by AC Benson to accompany Elgar's 'Pomp and Circumstance March No 1' music. It was for Edward VII's coronation and he - just like the present queen - was monarch of Great Britain and not just England. So, it is a ‘national anthem' for England only in the sense that 'Flower of Scotland' or ‘Land of my Fathers' is a ‘national anthem'...ie merely an occasional one.

[Quizmonster]

I should have added above that, despite being a Scot, I detest the 'Flower of Scotland' anthem. It - just like the 'God Save the...' one - is a ghastly dirge.
Someone has already mentioned Billy Connolly in this thread, so I feel entitled to add that I thought HIS idea for the British anthem should be based on the theme tune from The Archers. Lively and full of get up and go unlike the wretched, draggy thing we currently have.

[Mick-the-Miller]

But the problem with the Archers theme as a National Anthem for England is that there are no words and you definitely lose something if people just hum along.

Jerusalem is a fine stirring hymn that everyone remembers singing at school - Land of Hope and Glory would be fine there's probably others that I can't think of at the moment - you pays your money and takes your choice!

It could be worse - you could be Australian!!!

[inksplotter]

There are words for Barton Green; it goes "Dum de dum de dum. Dum de dum de di do..."

[ToraToraTora]

It's a wonderful song, I love it, I love belting it out at twickers with 86000 people. Only a whining anti English popingjay would criticise it's use in the Empire games. What should we have as the anthem? Clearly you haven't read the words as it does not suggest Jesus visited, it merely asks the question. Still I don't expect much where you are concerned.

[Mick-the-Miller]

Right, it's a series of questions - but over and above everything it's a fine stirring song that is miles better than the National Anthem dirge!

[dancecaller]

Surely the answer to the question 'was Jerusalem builded here?' is 'not yet, but we'll have a try'. What's jingoistic about that.

[dancecaller]

land of Hope and Glory is certainly jingoistic 'wider still and wider'....'make thee mighter yet'

Hmmm, what would be an appropriately PC anthem

[ChillDoubt]

I'm neither English nor religious but have to say that Jerusalem is one of the most stirring and moving pieces ever and the lyrics conjure up a fantastic, mythical image IMHO.

[maggiebee]

I don't think Roy Williamson of the Corries ever thought Flower of Scotland would become our National Anthem when he penned it all those years ago. He was a very patriotic Scot (still much missed) who would certainly have voted YES. I also love his song Scotland Will Flourish.

[turast]

Flower of Scotland is a boring dirge and anti English. Scots should be made to sing "Parcel of Rogues in a Nation". Jeffa you need to read a bit more about what Blake was obsessed with, and really meant when he wrote the poem. If you really want to see or hear jingoism / racism in an anthem, have a look at the French one. Unless you place anthems in their historical and/or literary context, words like jingoistic, colonial, imperial are pointless. If you want the anthem to reflect the real current state of England as a nation, I suggest "Dazed and Confused".

[maggiebee]

Turast - just as God Save the Queen is anti Scottish - read all the verses. I would be happy to adopt "Sic a Parcel o' Rogues in a Nation". Confirms my reasons to vote YES.

"Such a Parcel of Rogues in a Nation is a Scottish folk song whose lyrics are taken from an eponymous Robert Burns poem of 1791. It derides those members of the Parliament of Scotland who signed the Act of Union with England in 1707, comparing their treachery to the country with the tradition of martial valor and resistance commonly associated with such historic figures as Robert the Bruce and William Wallace. It has continued to be associated with Scottish nationalism and also been referenced in other situations where politicians' actions have gone against popular opinion."

[Brenden]

I seem to recall that in the past Land of hope and glory used to represent England in the games, and God save the queen for great britain.

[woofgang]

jeffa its a traditional story that Jesus visited England. His Uncle Joseph is said to have operated tin ships for the Romans and the tin is known to have come from Cornwall and Somerset. Jerusalem is in fact the first hymn to mention , however obliquely, the British Merchant Navy. not jingoistic at all, no mention of war.

[ludwig]

The hymn is actually based on genuine speculation\myth\legend that JC may have visited England and planted a tree at Glastonbury (or something like that) rather than just randomly saying 'England's so great I bet Jesus was here'.

I think it's a good song. I'm surprised it's not been ditched on the grounds that it's too Christian though, and not 'inclusive'* enough.

*ie muslims might object to it.