ChatterBank1 min ago
Visa entry to the U.S with criminal record?
Hi all,
I recently went to Spain and was arrested for criminal damage along with a friend (the smashing of a glass door). We have a trial in July but are meant to be going to New York in November and have only just realised that visa's will be needed now.
Assuming that we are going to get found guilty (they wont believe a word we say with us being British and in another European country) we are not even attending the trial.
What I need to know is where the US authorities stand on criminal damage charges with regards to entry to the US? I've read about something called "moral turpitude" and I cant see how "supposedly" smashing a door would constitute the same treatment as a murderer or drug dealer with regards to visa's.
Would the case be treated differently with the conviction being in a different country to my home country(UK)?
Would it even show up on records?
Also I've read about a vise waiver program where you can "tick" boxes saying you have no convictions etc before you get off the plane. Would this actually work?
Thanks
Sveney
I recently went to Spain and was arrested for criminal damage along with a friend (the smashing of a glass door). We have a trial in July but are meant to be going to New York in November and have only just realised that visa's will be needed now.
Assuming that we are going to get found guilty (they wont believe a word we say with us being British and in another European country) we are not even attending the trial.
What I need to know is where the US authorities stand on criminal damage charges with regards to entry to the US? I've read about something called "moral turpitude" and I cant see how "supposedly" smashing a door would constitute the same treatment as a murderer or drug dealer with regards to visa's.
Would the case be treated differently with the conviction being in a different country to my home country(UK)?
Would it even show up on records?
Also I've read about a vise waiver program where you can "tick" boxes saying you have no convictions etc before you get off the plane. Would this actually work?
Thanks
Sveney
Answers
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(2-part post):
I'll get the most important bit out of the way first:
The US immigration authorities have no direct access to the criminal records of other countries (except Canada). So it's extremely unlikely they would know about a conviction for a relatively minor offence in another country. Therefore it's likely that if you answer 'No' to the relevant question (about crimes of moral turpitude) on the visa waiver form without worrying that the US authorities will know about your conviction. (You might be entitled to do that anyway. There seems to be no universal definition of 'moral turpitude'. Different websites, including those of US universities and government departments offer differing opinions).
However, the US embassy website doesn't refer to crimes of moral turpitude. It simply insists that anyone who has ever been arrested (even if totally innocent) or convicted of an offence (except minor motoring offences) must obtain a visa.
I'll get the most important bit out of the way first:
The US immigration authorities have no direct access to the criminal records of other countries (except Canada). So it's extremely unlikely they would know about a conviction for a relatively minor offence in another country. Therefore it's likely that if you answer 'No' to the relevant question (about crimes of moral turpitude) on the visa waiver form without worrying that the US authorities will know about your conviction. (You might be entitled to do that anyway. There seems to be no universal definition of 'moral turpitude'. Different websites, including those of US universities and government departments offer differing opinions).
However, the US embassy website doesn't refer to crimes of moral turpitude. It simply insists that anyone who has ever been arrested (even if totally innocent) or convicted of an offence (except minor motoring offences) must obtain a visa.
The process involves getting hold of a copy of your UK police record (even if it's completely blank). That can take up to 40 days. (Fee �10). [It's also possible that they might demand a copy of your Spanish criminal record]. You then have to make an appointment to attend the US embassy in London for an interview. (Application fee $100. Typical waiting time around 2 to 3 weeks). While waiting, you can download the relevant forms and complete them. After your interview (where you have to hand over �13.50 to pay for a courier to return your passport), there's a long wait before you'll hear from the embassy. (One one page of their website, they state a minimum of 8 week. On another they quote a minimum period of 14 to 16 weeks). While you're waiting, your passport will be at the embassy, so you won't be able to travel abroad. (Note that even if you started the application process now, you might still be 'cutting it fine' to get your visa before November).
So, your best option seems to be simply to 'keep quiet' about the incident in Spain and answer 'No' to the question you're asked on the form you fill in on the plane.
Chris
So, your best option seems to be simply to 'keep quiet' about the incident in Spain and answer 'No' to the question you're asked on the form you fill in on the plane.
Chris
Thanks for that answer, it helps alot.
Can you just clear a few things up for me though. Am I right in saying that everyone has to fill out a form if they are travelling from the UK? So my friends who have no records would still have to do the same as me?
Do you know of anyone who has done this and got away with it?
What would happen if I was caught? Would I just get sent back to the UK?
The new passports they have in Britain have the electronic swipe chip, will my criminal record not show up when they swipe this?
Thanks again.
Sveney.
Can you just clear a few things up for me though. Am I right in saying that everyone has to fill out a form if they are travelling from the UK? So my friends who have no records would still have to do the same as me?
Do you know of anyone who has done this and got away with it?
What would happen if I was caught? Would I just get sent back to the UK?
The new passports they have in Britain have the electronic swipe chip, will my criminal record not show up when they swipe this?
Thanks again.
Sveney.
Thanks for the reply.
Yes, your friends (with no convictions) will have to complete the form.
Several AB contributors have posted to say that they've been admitted (with criminal convictions) to the USA by simply lying on the visa waiver form.
The chip in your passport would only 'start alarm bells ringing' if your name was on a 'watch list', based upon information provided by the UK (or Spanish) authorities. It's almost certain that the UK won't have passed any information on. I very much doubt that Spain will
have done so, either.
In the unlikely event of you being found out, you would be refused admission to the USA and sent back to the UK. You would be expected to pay for a ticket for the next available flight back (which might be quite expensive). If you couldn't do so (and if the British consulate wouldn't lend you the money) you'd be held in detention until you could catch your scheduled flight home.
Chris
Yes, your friends (with no convictions) will have to complete the form.
Several AB contributors have posted to say that they've been admitted (with criminal convictions) to the USA by simply lying on the visa waiver form.
The chip in your passport would only 'start alarm bells ringing' if your name was on a 'watch list', based upon information provided by the UK (or Spanish) authorities. It's almost certain that the UK won't have passed any information on. I very much doubt that Spain will
have done so, either.
In the unlikely event of you being found out, you would be refused admission to the USA and sent back to the UK. You would be expected to pay for a ticket for the next available flight back (which might be quite expensive). If you couldn't do so (and if the British consulate wouldn't lend you the money) you'd be held in detention until you could catch your scheduled flight home.
Chris
PS: As far as I can tell from the definitions of 'moral turpitude' put forward by various 'official' websites, you can probably answer 'No' to the relevant question on the form, without actually lying. 'Moral turpitude' seems to include drug offences, sexual offences and dishonesty but not 'criminal damage'. (So you'd only be breaking the rules which are cited by the US embassy but not contravening the requirements of the Visa Waiver Program, as specified on the actual form).
Chris
Chris
Hi there, need a bit of advice here, I was caught in possesison of a small amount of weed at the starts of NOV 06, I was not arrested or taken to the Police station however, They read somethin out in the car, and he told me to go and that i might get a letter from them! This was nine months ago and I have not heard a word, I am travelling to USA for holiday soon with family and dont know if i have or should declare a criminal record or conviction? I would appreciate your advice as to what i can do ? i have neveer been in troublw wiht police and am almost certain this would be a forts offence...9 months on is it liekly i will be charged or go to court?? Thanks for your help PLEASE REPLY ! Nyarif
Hi there, need a bit of advice here, I was caught in possesison of a small amount of weed at the starts of NOV 06, I was not arrested or taken to the Police station however, They read somethin out in the car, and he told me to go and that i might get a letter from them! This was nine months ago and I have not heard a word, I am travelling to USA for holiday soon with family and dont know if i have or should declare a criminal record or conviction? I would appreciate your advice as to what i can do ? i have neveer been in troublw wiht police and am almost certain this would be a forts offence...9 months on is it liekly i will be charged or go to court?? Thanks for your help PLEASE REPLY !
-- answer removed --
If you've been that stupid once, chances are, you will be again. And when they find out, because you get arrested (however much you proclaim your innocence about the Spain incident) then it will all come up, you'll be incarcerated, and then deported - and then your passport *will ring bells* in the future. Chances are you'll be sweating so much when you go through customs their 6th Sense will be activated - either postpone your trip, and go through the correct channels, or cancel it.
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