Following on from Theft by Consumption

[Oneeyedvic]

I read with interest the debate about the rights and wrongs. Personally, I think it is wrong.

However, on Sunday morning I went out for a long bike ride. After 20 miles I stopped at a petrol station with a Tescos Express and went to the chiller cabinet to get myself a bottle of water,

I was pretty knackered and since there was a queue, I opened the bottle and started to consume the water. Once I got to the front of the queue, I closed the top of the bottle, gave it to the cashier, apologised that I had started drinking it. She scanned it and I paid for it and walked out.

It differs from the banana incident in Sainsburys because:

a) The product in question had a bar code
b) I had finished my shopping and was in the queue
c) I had no other items to purchase

Is this acceptable behaviour?

[oldmaggie]

Well......at a petrol station it is the norm to fill up before you pay

[hippyhoppy]

when my kids were little I often found myself paying for empty packets of things after plying the kids with food stuffs to shut them up whilst shopping at Sainsburys.. never had a problem.. (ps didn't read the original thread so maybe barking up the wrong tree...) ;-)

[buildersmate]

Probably, because you knew you shouldn't really do it.

The issue I had with the other questioner was that she felt it was acceptable and she felt that the Store Manager was out of order. It was therefore a moral issue, not a legal issue.
Then the other thread got hijacked off-track by those seeking to establish if theft had occurred.
It never was an issue of theft for me - but of morals and behaviour.

[123everton]

What if by some misfortune you were unable to pay?
Perhaps there was a hole in your pocket, or your card was damaged or account empty, what then?

[joggerjayne]

You are standing in front of the payment counter, conspicuously holding a bottle which, as you say, can still be scanned (inlike a banana, which can no longer be weighed).

Technically, you are in the wrong ...

... but only the most anal person would complain about what you were doing.

And if they did, you would laugh at them, get to the front of the queue, pay for the bottle, and laugh at them some more as you were leaving.

=0)

ps. 20 miles ... quite a decent ride ... well done you !!

[joggerjayne]

Everton's ...

People in petrol stations frequently get to the checkout with no means of paying.

I've done it before ... pull in, fill up, open bag ... purse not there.

They take your registration (or bike details, LOL) and you have to go back and pay within 24 hours.

[hippyhoppy]

lol jayne - 'laugh at them some more as you were leaving' .. that's it... I'm off to Sainsbury's to annoy the staff... ;-)

[DaisyMae]

I can see where you are coming from Buildersmate but the law in this country has built up over centuries to cover all aspects of immorality and wrongdoing. There are situations where the moral and legal aspect is not clear-cut and I believe this was one of them. I do not condone petty theft. Theft is theft in my book but I have been shopping with very small children and I know the pressures and problems which face a young mother. So taking all that into account I made the judgement that there was no intent to permanently deprive the rightful owner of the banana of either the item or its value. It seemed likely to me that no crime had been committed and since the lady intended to pay for the item, not really a moral breakdown either.

Having said all that, I do hope the lady made it clear to her child (as I did to mine) that it is wrong to take something that doesn't belong to you, it is called stealing.

[joggerjayne]

hippety ... beware ... !!

I posted on the supermarket thread and said the lady was in the wrong ...

Different circumstances.

In supermarket, eating food and NOT paying for it happens a lot, and my answer was different !!

[Oneeyedvic]

Thanks JJ - was a 35 mile trip in total - just had a quick break after the 20 miles for a quick top up of liquid :)

Thanks everyone for responses.

Reading through the other thread, I agreed that what she did was wrong - but then it occurred to me that I might be being hypocritical.

[123everton]

I agree you'd have to bit uptight to complain overly about it, I don't eat things in the shop before I've paid for it but that's just me.
But shops do lose a fortune due to these actions, if I worked in a shop I'd keep my powder dry until they reached the checkout, once they've paid for the item you have to admit no trip no foul.
Harking back to the earlier question that inspired this one, I do work with the public and they can be truly horrible, I sympathise with any shop worker faced with that dilemma, because if they don't have the money, or it was their intention not to pay for it (by discarding the item) because you don't know until they try (it takes all sorts) and, when it does, it means only one thing.
A fight.

[joggerjayne]

Diasy ...

I think in the Sainsbury's case, there was actually a theft.

The test is not whether you intend to "deprive the rightful owner of the banana of either the item or its value"

It is ...

Permanently depriving the owner of the item (yes)

Doing an act inconsistent with the rights of the owner (yes)

(At the time of consumption, the shop was still the owner)

Intending to reimburse the owner later is not a defence (unless you're an MP, apparently).

So drinking the water was also, technically, theft.

But supermarkets have a massive problem with people eating their food, down the aisles, out of sight.

Petrol stations don't have such a problem.

[ojread2]

I read that thread
I fail to see why the customer thought it was OK to let her child eat anything before paying for it?
Which ever way you look at it, it's stealing because it doesn't become yours to eat before you purchase?
LOL @ maggie, but you can't drive away from a petrol station before paying

[joggerjayne]

Everton ...

I'm LOL at the image of a young mum, with a baby in the trolley, having a punch up with the checkout girl.

Would they jelly wrestle ???

LOL