Crosswords2 mins ago
Labour Voters????
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6% of Labour supporters polled voted for a non-existent candidate for Party Leader. Does this tell us anything about their voters?
Answers
The question is surely how deeply embedded in the mind-set of their supporters lies a deeply engrained Marxist view of history that can never be dislodged by any sense of global or economic realism? To me they are securely locked in the past and will never change. How then can Labour ever hope to win power unless they do a Blair aberration in order to persuade...
01:44 Mon 22nd Jun 2015
Reading the article more closely it appears that the 'Stewart Lewis' poll is 'Who would Britons like to see leading the Labour Party' whereas the one for Labour supporters (however they decide who 'Labour supporters' are is a separate one with the genuine candidates only
So it looks like a 'let's all laugh at dumb Britain' exercise which strikes me as rather childish for an allegedly serious polling organisation
So it looks like a 'let's all laugh at dumb Britain' exercise which strikes me as rather childish for an allegedly serious polling organisation
They're also in a sense making a mockery of their own business as well as their respondents because it suggests that you can't really trust anyone to know anything about any of the candidates.
And of course a poll involving non labour supporters (however they decide who they are also) is going to be hopelessly misleading because there'll be people who have different reasons for wanting x rather than y and no way of distinguishing between them
And of course a poll involving non labour supporters (however they decide who they are also) is going to be hopelessly misleading because there'll be people who have different reasons for wanting x rather than y and no way of distinguishing between them
The question is surely how deeply embedded in the mind-set of their supporters lies a deeply engrained Marxist view of history that can never be dislodged by any sense of global or economic realism? To me they are securely locked in the past and will never change.
How then can Labour ever hope to win power unless they do a Blair aberration in order to persuade more open-minded voters to vote for them when they know they can never stop being loyal to the historic values of their core supporters? It is an impossibility, but that won't stop them, and their allies in the media, especially the unionised BBC News from sickening us all already with their attempts to do just that.
When I switch on BBC News and hear the word Labour I just change channel and find something real to watch or listen to. But I still have to pay for my BBC TV licence.
Labour is an anachronism to me. Their work is done, and now almost every car you see on our roads comes from abroad or is assembled in the UK by a foreign company.
How then can Labour ever hope to win power unless they do a Blair aberration in order to persuade more open-minded voters to vote for them when they know they can never stop being loyal to the historic values of their core supporters? It is an impossibility, but that won't stop them, and their allies in the media, especially the unionised BBC News from sickening us all already with their attempts to do just that.
When I switch on BBC News and hear the word Labour I just change channel and find something real to watch or listen to. But I still have to pay for my BBC TV licence.
Labour is an anachronism to me. Their work is done, and now almost every car you see on our roads comes from abroad or is assembled in the UK by a foreign company.
Some people say that it's in Labour's interest to keep people on benefits and in poverty, seeing as that's their client base.
Personally, I don't entirely agree with that. I think their client base is the overpaid, underworked state sector. Sort of people making a spectacle of themselves, in London, yesterday.
Personally, I don't entirely agree with that. I think their client base is the overpaid, underworked state sector. Sort of people making a spectacle of themselves, in London, yesterday.
Yes OK as long as they accept it is the democratic wish of the majority of the UK people who have unselfishly voted against the profligacy of a public service trade union backed party in order that our children and their children and their children's children don't have to be burdened with paying off the exponential wages, pensions and costs of our unionised public services.
Most of us around my age (60) have spent our working lives paying off the debts our government incurred during the last two World wars. I considered a privilege to do so because it was just money and not my life that I had to sacrifice for our country.
I very much think that future generations will not feel the same way about the debts that top-down (as opposed to sustainable bottom up) unionised Labour stateist economics could otherwise have left them with.
Labour's work is done- by that I meant that employees now have more rights under law than the people who employ them. We have the welfare state that has genuinely poor people from all over the world desperately trying to come here (leading even some to risk hiding in the undercarriage of a plane and dying) to get here possibly due to the BBC World Service telling them all what a wonderful place the UK is.
Labour want us to pay billions a year to the EU in return for our roads swamped with cars manufactured in the EU but outside the UK ( next to our homes the next biggest investment we make in our lives is our cars).
But most of all Labour as a political party don't know what they stand for- until that is they are told what they stand for by the unions. These relics (unions) hang on in the public services mainly these days where they have persuaded every employee in the 2 billion pounds a week NHS, the fourth largest employer in the world, that they are victims who need to strike for more money for less work.
Meanwhile, thanks to intelligent, global realist, non-idealistic voters we have a rational government that will hopefully prevent my grandchildren's children from having to live in a debt-ridden third world slum conurbation.
Most of us around my age (60) have spent our working lives paying off the debts our government incurred during the last two World wars. I considered a privilege to do so because it was just money and not my life that I had to sacrifice for our country.
I very much think that future generations will not feel the same way about the debts that top-down (as opposed to sustainable bottom up) unionised Labour stateist economics could otherwise have left them with.
Labour's work is done- by that I meant that employees now have more rights under law than the people who employ them. We have the welfare state that has genuinely poor people from all over the world desperately trying to come here (leading even some to risk hiding in the undercarriage of a plane and dying) to get here possibly due to the BBC World Service telling them all what a wonderful place the UK is.
Labour want us to pay billions a year to the EU in return for our roads swamped with cars manufactured in the EU but outside the UK ( next to our homes the next biggest investment we make in our lives is our cars).
But most of all Labour as a political party don't know what they stand for- until that is they are told what they stand for by the unions. These relics (unions) hang on in the public services mainly these days where they have persuaded every employee in the 2 billion pounds a week NHS, the fourth largest employer in the world, that they are victims who need to strike for more money for less work.
Meanwhile, thanks to intelligent, global realist, non-idealistic voters we have a rational government that will hopefully prevent my grandchildren's children from having to live in a debt-ridden third world slum conurbation.
Svejk, Labour members and Labour supporters are two different things ie Members get a vote Supporters do not. ( unless they are Members ... so all those that voted Thatcher in were not all members of the Conservative Party)
Colmc54, please explain what this " deeply engrained Marxist view of history that can never be dislodged by any sense of global or economic realism?" is.
Colmc54, please explain what this " deeply engrained Marxist view of history that can never be dislodged by any sense of global or economic realism?" is.
Colmc54> "...against the profligacy of a public service trade union backed party"
The majority of the Public Sector did not vote Labour in 2015
https:/
"Since 2008 job cuts in the public sector have fallen disproportionately on the regions and devolved nations outside of London. As a result of this, London and the South East have increased their share of public sector jobs as a proportion of the national total. Interestingly, however, London has also been the region with the fastest rate of private sector job growth in this period.
This suggests that simplistic assertions about the public sector ‘crowding out’ private sector job creation need to be challenged if we are to build a more sustainable and equitable economic settlement for the UK."
http://
The majority of the Public Sector did not vote Labour in 2015
https:/
"Since 2008 job cuts in the public sector have fallen disproportionately on the regions and devolved nations outside of London. As a result of this, London and the South East have increased their share of public sector jobs as a proportion of the national total. Interestingly, however, London has also been the region with the fastest rate of private sector job growth in this period.
This suggests that simplistic assertions about the public sector ‘crowding out’ private sector job creation need to be challenged if we are to build a more sustainable and equitable economic settlement for the UK."
http://
Sorry. All too often these days I get too hyperbolic in my posts. Let me try and explain what I truly think is the problem.
There is only one planet on which Homo sapiens exists. The resources of our planet are FINITE while the reproductive capacity of our species appears not to be.
Against this global reality the attempts of populist politicians aimed at putting each national electorate around the world in it's own idealistic bubble so that it can be more easily manipulated by them and their patrons are in danger of being rejected by more free-thinking voters who view their arguments as self-serving and anachronistic.
The reason I posted the above was to point out that Labour is the property of the TUC. It was created by them and succeeded in it's goals of making the UK a bubble that everyone who believes in unconditional human entitlement can be proud of. They/it have now served their purpose.
The problem is, like all bubbles whether physical or ideological, they are doomed to burst and collapse if they cannot equilibrate with their surroundings.
The last election was all about bubble populism from Labour and the SNP versus global realism from the party that won. So what I meant was that Labour has to respectfully turn it's back on it's past (job done and dusted), and try and look outwards at the rest of the world.
Europe is in decline. The West is in decline. The bubble could burst with a seemingly tiny pin-prick, yet Labour are still trapped in the ideologies of the past.
There is only one planet on which Homo sapiens exists. The resources of our planet are FINITE while the reproductive capacity of our species appears not to be.
Against this global reality the attempts of populist politicians aimed at putting each national electorate around the world in it's own idealistic bubble so that it can be more easily manipulated by them and their patrons are in danger of being rejected by more free-thinking voters who view their arguments as self-serving and anachronistic.
The reason I posted the above was to point out that Labour is the property of the TUC. It was created by them and succeeded in it's goals of making the UK a bubble that everyone who believes in unconditional human entitlement can be proud of. They/it have now served their purpose.
The problem is, like all bubbles whether physical or ideological, they are doomed to burst and collapse if they cannot equilibrate with their surroundings.
The last election was all about bubble populism from Labour and the SNP versus global realism from the party that won. So what I meant was that Labour has to respectfully turn it's back on it's past (job done and dusted), and try and look outwards at the rest of the world.
Europe is in decline. The West is in decline. The bubble could burst with a seemingly tiny pin-prick, yet Labour are still trapped in the ideologies of the past.
Colmc54, unless you define this 'populism' you mention, we will get nowhere.
You appear to be implying that the demands, indeed even the aspirations, of employees within the UK is a threat to the environment.
What exactly are these mysterious bubbles that exist "around the world" and what exactly is the one that exists in the UK ?
"Europe is in decline. The West is in decline. The bubble could burst with a seemingly tiny pin-prick, yet Labour are still trapped in the ideologies of the past. "
Do you fear an ideological bubble more than the current stock market/bond/derivative/housing bubbles ?
You appear to be implying that the demands, indeed even the aspirations, of employees within the UK is a threat to the environment.
What exactly are these mysterious bubbles that exist "around the world" and what exactly is the one that exists in the UK ?
"Europe is in decline. The West is in decline. The bubble could burst with a seemingly tiny pin-prick, yet Labour are still trapped in the ideologies of the past. "
Do you fear an ideological bubble more than the current stock market/bond/derivative/housing bubbles ?
