Psychic Feelings

[vernonk]

Do you believe that - maybe even have examples of - some people can somehow sense what you're thinking or feeling even if they're a long distance away and haven't seen in you in a long while?

[MadMen]

No, you just woke up unhappy and depressed.

[naomi24]

Humbersloop, not at all. Mrs.O’s claims are tangible – proof was forthcoming - whereas the claims of the religious are not tangible because proof of their claims is never forthcoming. I might add that when most of the atheists in R&S dismiss religion, they do provide hard evidence for the reasons for doing so.

(If you’re reading this Mrs.O, sorry to use you as an example, but you’re the only one to have given us an account of your experiences).

Jim, you might be wrong.

giveup, perhaps it was coincidence – or perhaps not.

[jim360]

Wrong about what? :)

I have anyway given this a great deal of thought, and apparently reached the opposite conclusion from you. One way or another though, I have not dismissed it "out of hand" -- I even offered earlier to give up some time to try and design a model for psychic abilities, and offer I note hasn't been replied to yet, but it may have just got buried. It still stands -- and I still promise that if I did design the model (and felt it was worth pursuing) I would let someone else plug in the numbers.

[jim360]

By "worth pursuing", just to clarify, I mean that I feel the model to be a reasonable attempt to describe what might be going on, rather than the exercise itself.

[daisya]

With my own experiences throughout many years I feel that these things cannot be just called up to happen so that they can be tested, that's my opinion. I don't know why but I think they are spontaneous and random happenings, that's probably why I have difficulty in taking in what professional mediums have to say when apparently they can conjure up their predictions at will. Perhaps my experiences are too random for that and I don't try to "tune in"!! It's just all natural to me as I've had these experiences since a child.

[naomi24]

Jim, //Wrong about what? //

Déjà vu.

//I even offered earlier to give up some time to try and design a model for psychic abilities//

We aren’t talking about ‘abilities’ here because whatever is happening appears to be occurring randomly and without any effort or intention on the part of the people involved – but if you want to construct some sort of experiment, go ahead. Just imagine – a Nobel Prize! ;o)

[naomi24]

Daisy, //these things cannot be just called up to happen so that they can be tested, that's my opinion. I don't know why but I think they are spontaneous and random happenings...//

Exactly!

[society]

"jomifl

The reason I am sceptical about the existence of psychic ability, telepathy etc. is that assuming that the electrical activity of the brain could be transmitted the power available is so small that any signal would be swamped by all the background noise.
@ 10.27


Naomi, the thought is the connection between the brain cells, just as an electrical circuit has differing outputs depending on how it is wired so the brain arrives at different outputs or thoughts. Your 'thought' is the expression of a bit of cellular 'rewiring'. "
@10.56


So those people who suddenly develop psychic abilities after being struct by lightening would be pure hog-wash to you. :)

[tonyav]

My belief is that these 'Psychic Feelings' happen to most people in one form or another during their life time. Won't go into detail, but I have had them from time to time.

[jim360]

Just to be clear -- my model would attempt to estimate a probability for such events occurring, and probably will not need to examine in any great detail the mechanism by which they occur. This will in fact completely deal with the perceived randomness of the effect. So I've got that covered -- most of modern physics is about examining random processes anyway, so it would be nothing new.

[naomi24]

Jim, //probably will not need to examine in any great detail the mechanism by which they occur. //

But that's exactly what we want to know. How they occur. A model on probability wouldn't answer that, so bye bye Nobel Prize. Back to the drawing board ..... or in my case up to bed.

Night all.

[daisya]

Just a thought....if the past has happened, is the future there waiting to happen and certain people can "tap into it" without asking or expecting to? I have "seen" so many things coming up over the years and have mentioned them without thinking that a family member always called me a Jonah! Meaning that things I said came true....sometimes not in a good way either.

[jim360]

One step at a time, though -- you can't expect me to become an expert in paranormal biophysics overnight!

What I'm proposing would be the first step -- examining whether or not such effects even could occur (that is, if a basic model would allow such events to have a reasonable probability of occurring). If the probability were vanishingly small even over the entire human existence and population then there wouldn't be much point in proceeding further -- if not because the effect doesn't exist, then because we would need too long to observe it.

And besides, I wouldn't need to present a complete theory to win the Nobel Prize -- just a convincing first step would be enough!

[jim360]

As to seeing the future... it depends largely on how precise your predictions were. Most professional psychics (accepted of course as frauds here) manage to get away with it by making vague statements that could be true about almost anything. "That thing you were dreading will happen soon..." for example -- which is almost guaranteed to be true as soon as a relative term and most people dread lots of things. "Your son will die next Tuesday" is rather less ambiguous. Most predictions seem to be of the first form and not the second. So the first question I would have to ask would be, were your predictions specific or general? And the second question would be, how often are you wrong?

I've yet to hear anyone report some sort of psychic episode and then say that their prediction didn't happen. It is, after all, a non-story. So there is an incredible amount of selection bias going on. That is not people being liars -- it's just people being people.

[society]

I say this - don't knock it until you've experienced it.

[daisya]

They were specific Jim, as in knowing when someone who was well at the time and no sign of illness would pass away with a short time. Not something I want to know or have to think of, these "thoughts" just come and I can't change what I think. It's happened lots, telepathy too as in knowing specifically what someone is going to say. It must be difficult for someone who has never experienced such a thing to believe it or take on board. That's why I never make a big deal of it because it's always been natural to me but even so, I am often amazed when something comes true because I don't always "believe" either.

[jim360]

Fair enough, perhaps -- though I have experienced apparent deja vu, and the number of times I get into a blind panic about some relative dying or other is beyond funny. So far my premonitions or (perhaps they are just imaginations? What is the difference anyway?) have been right exactly zero per cent of the time.

[jim360]

Thanks for the reply daisy. Glad you can understand my scepticism.

[naomi24]

Jim, //examining whether or not such effects even could occur//

Bearing in mind we don’t know how it happens, I can’t really see how you could examine whether or not such events could occur - and allowing ‘such events to have a reasonable probability of occurring’ seems like guesswork from the start to me, but if you want to have a go, why not?

Perhaps the Ed will agree to run a poll to ask people here if they’ve any experience of it. At least then you would have some figures as a starting point. Why not post something in the Editor’s Blog to ask him?

As for seeing the future, isn’t that what Mrs.O’s lady did?

[daisya]

I don't see how it could be studied either Naomi, to me it can't be harnessed so how can anyone try to examine it, you are right in what you say. Maybe things will change in the future for them to find out how it occurs, would be interesting if they could methinks.