Faith???

[Goodsoulette]

After a friend who has many people who loved him killed himself (he suffered with bipolar), I started to get pangs of doubt. Then I went through crisis after crisis, another friend died from a brain tumour, to top the personal things the little girl getting kidnapped and raped and the final straw war a mother with postnatal depression killing her baby by cutting of its arms. I cannot find a reason God would have for letting these things happen especially to the completely innocent.

Has anyone else ever totally lost their faith? (I was a practising CofE Christian)

[flashpig]

My aunt goes through up and down faith. She's been sectioned at the moment, but the madder she gets the more she seems to get into her religion. There was one point where she completely lost it, and she was okay, but she took up smoking Old Holburn instead and got a horrible chest infection.

[flashpig]

I don't know if I had a point there, other than my aunt's faith swings, so if you're worried about losing it, don't worry, it'll probably be back, but if you're giving up religion don't take up smoking.

There we go, I think I've recovered my rambling convoluted answer with a nice pat conclusion.

[dodamaksoud]

look everything happens for a reason, my advice is take it day by day, find a new career path maybe, maybe even find a new religion to suit your needs if it helps I'm a muslim and it's helped me understand why bad things happen to innocent people.

[smudge]

Years ago, a very dear friend of mine, gave birth to a beautiful baby girl, then found out at 2 years old, that she was suffering from a rare genetic defect which affects the nervous system.

By this time my friend was pregnant with her second child & eventually gave gave birth to another beautiful baby girl. After taking her along to Gr Ormond St Hospital for checks, she was also found to have the same gentic defect. My friend & her husband were told the life expectancy was approx 10 years for both of them.

Time went by & eventually the inevitable happened, the eldest daughter died at 9 years old. The youngest daughter died at 14 years old & they were totally devastated at losing both their daughters, as you can well imagine.

In time & after a lot of soul searching, they tried again for another child, admittedly against the consultants advice, but were eventually blessed with a baby boy. There was so much joy all round, as everyone thought being a boy, things might be different this time.....that was until they took him for checks at 6 months, only to be told he too had the same syndrome.

Shortly after hearing this, my friend's husband couldn't cope with the thought of losing yet another child, so decided to leave her for another woman. My friend went on to care for her son, with the help of her family, until he died aged just 16 years of age.

At the funeral, my friend released 3 white doves into the sky & one by one met up flew away together - just like her children.

Is there a God? All I know is, my friend will never see her children get married & will never be a Grandmother. It makes me feel so terribly guilty & sad for her.

[smudge]

*Scuse any mistakes, I pressed the submit button before I had a chance to edit!

[Quizmonkey]

If 'having a faith' is screwing you up so much, might it not be better if you did lose it? Who convinced you to have it in the first place? I don't want to offend anyone but blinkered religiosos who stick resolutely to some far-fetched creed - without questioning it - have been in my opinion some of the stupidest, most deluded people I have ever met.

[jake-the-peg]

If your bipolar friend or his family was religious I hope they treat his family well. Sadly a lot of religions have a poor record in the way they respond to suicides.

You'll probably have a lot of people tell you that this is all because "God has a purpose we cannot know" or that it is a consequence of our "free will" they've been stock answers for hundreds of years and many people find comfort in them.

Although I don't think I ever believed, I know a number of people who let go of their religous faith and I know it was painful especially for those who came from a strong religious community. Some lost friends at the same time. But they came through it and are some of the strongest, most moral people I know.

I do wonder if a religous person can ever see a crime such as murder in the same way as an athiest for whom killing is the complete and utter extinction of a concious individual.

Best of luck however you decide

[kick3m0n]

Smudge that is such a heartbreakingly sad story. I can't begin to imagine what your friends went through.

[smudge]

Even though I was Christened, I'm not so sure there is a God, although I like to think someone is looking after my Mum & Dad, etc.....who knows?

I just believe in 'What is to be, is to be' & 'There's a reason for everything'.

[smudge]

Thank you for those words kick.

I've known my friend since we were 11 years old & she was always such a kind, loving, happy person. She used to phone me when she was going through each trauma, or just having a bad day & I would usually have her smiling by the time she put the phone down.

To see her at each of her children's funeral, was so hard for me personally. We are still the closest of friends & she often refers to me as 'her Angel' - isn't that nice.

[Supernick]

I did my dissertation at university on the problem of evil and a Christian God. At it's centre you have 3 points of a triangle

1. God is omnipotent (all powerful)

2. God is omniscient (all knowing)

3. Evil Exists.

It would appear that you can only believe 2 points of the triangle. For example if God is all powerful then surely he would stop evil. So perhaps he does not know it is happening. Perhaps he is all knowing but is powerless to stop it. Of course perhaps he is both but evil doesn't exist (a whole other philosophical tangent). I personally found John Hick's Soul Making Theodicy to be the most compelling of all arguments put forward. In too little detail to justify it, evil exists in order for us to build our souls. If only good existed then we could never have the choice to be good. We could never develp to enter heaven. I always had a problem with the idea that it was somehow necessary to kill 6 million Jews in the second wold war. Would 5 million have the same affect? Is it justified? As far as I'm concerned, no, not even a little bit. This has been so extensively argued for centuries the debate cannot be summed up in a couple of paragraphs, but there are hundreds of texts you could have a look at to examine it further.

[andy-hughes]

By definition, faith is a concept that cannot be proven.

Many people find their faith shaken, if not broken, by the events that happen in their lives, and the lives of those closest to them. The response from the Church is that God tests his human flock often, and sometimes deeply, but it is done with love.

As an aetheist, I have no problem accepting the dreaful things that heppen - because they happen, so I'm sorry i cannot offer any practical advice on your doubts, other than yo discuss them with your minister, and see if putting your thoughts into order and telling someone who cares helps you to find your faith, or decide that it has indeed deserrted you.

I am sure that as a Christian, this must be deeply distressing for you, and as a fellow human being, I feel for you, and I hope you reach the peace you seek.

[4getmenot]

I have lost 3 friends through suicide, plenty in crashes and I always think 'why god' or when I am desperate need its 'please god' yet I dont particularly believe in god. I do think that things happen for a reason its just how the world turns.

[Drisgirl]

Firstly Goodsoulette and smudge these are tragic events where if I did have a faith I would doubt it.

I am agnostic and always have been.However when I lost my beloved nannie I cried every day for a year - no particular trigger.When I was really down a little white feather would flutter down - I knew she was there saying come on I'm still looking after you.I was in Amsterdam sitting outside a pub (theres a surprise) and it was a lovely spring day.watching canal boats going past and to the side of a flower market.I thought - she would have loved this- next thing a pure white feather fluttered down at my feet.

Poo poo it all you like but the comfort it gave me was indescribable.I'm still agnostic but there is something there to help you or we would all go to pieces.

[Englishbird]

just wrote a long answer and then computer said no!! grrr. will try and summarise.

As a child I was told there was a god and didn't question this until I was 12 years old when my grandmother was very ill as a result of my grandad's death. I just remember it all being very traumatic for my family, and I decided that I didn't believe what I had been told anymore.

I find more comfort in believing in the balance of nature, yin and yang, good and bad, and that you cannot have one without the other. What I don't understand is how people can praise 'god' for all the good things but not blame 'god' for the bad things. Surely that's a rather convenient selection.

Probably not helping much but know that the pain goes enough to allow you to continue, and we carry on as humans doing the best we can x

[lkn2cln]

Everything happends for a reason.You can look at the bad and just sit and think "how sad" or you can think how lucky you are to not be suffering with those illnesses.I found myself not reading the newspaper or watching TV because I was starting to get scared.I didn't want my children to go outside or I didn't even want to go in a car.You will always have bad things happend around the world but you try to let the good things stand out more.Even if it is as small as a flower or a beautiful butterfly.You never know what the next day brings.;)

[smudge]

Thank you Drisgirl - also, sorry to hear about your Nannie. If seeing a white feather makes you think nice thoughts about her, then that's a good positive thing for you.

Sounds like we have very similar thoughts on this subject forgetmenot & EB.

[smudge]

My friend expressed similar sentiments when all of her three children died IAP.

Hope you feel better soon.