ChatterBank3 mins ago
What would Lord Robert Baden-Powell have said?
66 Answers
http://www.telegraph....w-to-secularists.html
So it looks like the Girl Guides are set to drop their oath to God, just because two families have objected to the oath.
/// Caroline Mason said her daughter had felt unable to take part in her Brownies enrolment in north Somerset due to the religious content of the Promise.///
/// A second complaint came from Juliette and Barry Willett, who said their daughter Maddie had been excluded from a ceremony in Crawley Down, West Sussex. ///
/// "She's incredibly upset at the idea that she can't be a fully fledged Brownie," said Mrs Willett. ///
Perhaps these two girls should not have joined a movement founded on true Christian beliefs?
So it looks like the Girl Guides are set to drop their oath to God, just because two families have objected to the oath.
/// Caroline Mason said her daughter had felt unable to take part in her Brownies enrolment in north Somerset due to the religious content of the Promise.///
/// A second complaint came from Juliette and Barry Willett, who said their daughter Maddie had been excluded from a ceremony in Crawley Down, West Sussex. ///
/// "She's incredibly upset at the idea that she can't be a fully fledged Brownie," said Mrs Willett. ///
Perhaps these two girls should not have joined a movement founded on true Christian beliefs?
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It's a long time since the Girl Guides (an organisation that functions all over the world) has been a specifically Christian enterprise. Baden-Powell set up the Scouts to be the training ground for imperialists rather than Christians, but that no longer has much currency either. Oaths have long been peripheral to either organisation, and there's no point in excluding possible members by insisting on them.
I agree that this needs to be updated. Scout and Guide organisations should be multidenominational - or none. I'm involved with the Air Cadets and they have no religious affiliation, they accept all comers - they do have a padre (as one would expect from a service organisation) and support events at the local church, but cultural and religious awareness is a large part of the organisation's ethos.
I was a Beaver Scout leader some years ago. It was always understood that boys (it was only boys in those days) who were of non-Christian faith could adapt the promise to 'my God/Allah/Krishna' or whatever.
Since then though, I've become enlightened and am now an atheist. I would not even think of joining the Scouts or Guides these days, purely because of the religious nature of the organisation.
Maybe these girls would better off joining the Woodcraft Folk: http://www.woodcraft.org.uk/
Since then though, I've become enlightened and am now an atheist. I would not even think of joining the Scouts or Guides these days, purely because of the religious nature of the organisation.
Maybe these girls would better off joining the Woodcraft Folk: http://www.woodcraft.org.uk/
-- answer removed --
Progress at last as the GG change to the times - most of us are agnostic/aetheist - what is it now, less than 5% who go to Church regularly and less than 3% who go weekly. The GG and BS need to become more secular and open to all.
As to the article, there is an element of a "storm in a tea cup" as Ms M and J and B W didn't get their way straight up. And shyte-stirring knowing that the aged right-wingers such as Major Fotherington-Gusset of Somerset and AOG will take the call to arms.
As to the article, there is an element of a "storm in a tea cup" as Ms M and J and B W didn't get their way straight up. And shyte-stirring knowing that the aged right-wingers such as Major Fotherington-Gusset of Somerset and AOG will take the call to arms.
Christian beliefs?
Baden Powell was a paedophile.
This is well known and documented.
http://www.glgarden.o...g/archive1/baden.html
Makes me laugh when someone is held up to be a paragon of moral virtues, when all he wants is to see naked kids running about.
Baden Powell was a paedophile.
This is well known and documented.
http://www.glgarden.o...g/archive1/baden.html
Makes me laugh when someone is held up to be a paragon of moral virtues, when all he wants is to see naked kids running about.
-- answer removed --
saxy_jag
/// Since then though, I've become enlightened and am now an atheist. I would not even think of joining the Scouts or Guides these days, purely because of the religious nature of the organisation. ///
That's fair enough, you were free to make your choices, and anyone else who feels the same also have the choice to join or not to join.
Why change any organization just for the few?
The Boy's Brigade is strictly a church organisation, perhaps they should also change, then why go even further, and perhaps remove the words 'God save our Gracious Queen' from our anthem?
/// Since then though, I've become enlightened and am now an atheist. I would not even think of joining the Scouts or Guides these days, purely because of the religious nature of the organisation. ///
That's fair enough, you were free to make your choices, and anyone else who feels the same also have the choice to join or not to join.
Why change any organization just for the few?
The Boy's Brigade is strictly a church organisation, perhaps they should also change, then why go even further, and perhaps remove the words 'God save our Gracious Queen' from our anthem?
AOG, you complain about the 'youth of today', but when an organisation - that does a very good job for our young people - suggests it might move with the times in order to accommodate more of them, you object. Personally, I'd like to see more of our kids getting involved in groups like Scouts, Guides, etc, so I really can't work out your reasoning on that one.
sp1814
/// Baden Powell was a paedophile. ///
It is ironic that you state this, seeing that you are always saying the pedophiles are mainly white males, but it is well known by many that Baden-Powell was most certainly a repressed homosexual, also a female impersonator.
In his early service life he loved to surround himself with young good looking male subalterns and assistants.
/// Baden-Powell also had a decades-long friendship with Kenneth McLaren, with whom he served in the military and with whom he shared accommodations as often as he could.///
http://www.bookrescue.../scoutingfounder.html
/// Baden Powell was a paedophile. ///
It is ironic that you state this, seeing that you are always saying the pedophiles are mainly white males, but it is well known by many that Baden-Powell was most certainly a repressed homosexual, also a female impersonator.
In his early service life he loved to surround himself with young good looking male subalterns and assistants.
/// Baden-Powell also had a decades-long friendship with Kenneth McLaren, with whom he served in the military and with whom he shared accommodations as often as he could.///
http://www.bookrescue.../scoutingfounder.html
http://www.guardian.c...ay/28/childprotection
perhaps this, jno. There has always been rumours but nothing definite, repressed yes and he liked photos but there is no direct proof......Kitchener as well was "indicted" as well apparently, for a cover up of B-P so called activities
perhaps this, jno. There has always been rumours but nothing definite, repressed yes and he liked photos but there is no direct proof......Kitchener as well was "indicted" as well apparently, for a cover up of B-P so called activities
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