Female circumcision.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail....llegally-Britain.html

With as many as 100,000 women who have undergone this brutal genital mutilation illegally in Britain, why are the police failing to act against this barbaric practice?

/// The Metropolitan Police said since 2008, it had received 166 reports of people who fear they are at risk of FGM but it has failed to bring forward a single perpetrator. ///

/// It is the same for all 43 forces across England and Wales with no convictions for the offence ever taking place.///

[keyplus90]

And after last post perhaps Jomifle can give a helping hand to naomi in finding its link with Islam.

[FredPuli43]

More than abh,though it's certainly that, it's surely grievous bodily harm inflicted with intent to cause it, a much more serious offence. But whichever it is, it's difficult to detect offenders when they are shielded by a particular culture that simultaneously thinks the practice sound and necessary but knows it's illegal.
The practitioners seen by The Sunday Times must be in the frame for being prosecuted though. It would have helped if every one of them had been given money upfront, though the girls were fictional, so as to establish the serious intent and get a charge of conspiracy running.

[jomifl]

Keyplus , it's link with islam is that it seems to be carried out almost exclusively by muslims. You are free to condemn the practice any time you wish.

[andy-hughes]

I recall from a documentary, that one of the reasons why the practice continues is that mothers who endured it as children think their daughters should endure it too - a rather spieteful and non-maternal vierwpoint, but as has been advised at length, cultural differences do exist in the world.

Like all cultural practices which go against common human decency, these practices will eventually die out, but sdadly, it will take a few more generations before this kind of cruelty becomes a thing of the past.

To address OAG's Question specifically, I suspect that a culturql practice that is known to be frowned upon by European culture, to say nothing of law, is likely to hide behind a wall of secrey and silence which would make discovery extremely difficult, and prosecution virtually impossible.

[ummmm]

What I would like to know is, what type of man would enjoy sex with a woman, knowing their sexual parts had been removed?

In my experience, and I haven't been with loads of men!!!!, getting a woman 'in the mood' is the most exciting part.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, you seem to have conveniently forgotten that we’ve been through this several times before and you should know better than to doubt my word, because unlike you, I don’t post statements I can’t corroborate.

http://www.theanswerb...uestion1080630-2.html

And I don’t think this bit was included in that thread.

Um Atiyyat al-Ansariyyah said: A woman used to perform circumcision in Medina. The Prophet (pbuh) said to her: Do not cut too severely as that is better for a woman and more desirable for a husband.

Muslims are encouraged to emulate the prophet Mohammed, who according to Islam, is beyond reproach in deed and word, and you and your apologists, may deny it all you like, but the truth is that for those Muslims who advocate this disgusting procedure, a ‘cultural’ practice it is not. There is no doubt whatsoever that they use Islamic literature to justify it as a requirement of their religion.

[anotheoldgit]

A number of poster have said how difficult it would be to trace those who have had this vicious assault on their bodies.

Well surely they have to use the services of the NHS from time to time, why can't they then be counselled to find out who committed this illegal act upon them?

If they refused to give the appropriate information, at least the authorities would know where they lived enabling the Police to then investigate.

[andy-hughes]

ummmm - again this is a cultural difference. The men who appreciate this mutilation will enjoy knowing that they are the first man to have sex with a woman treated in this way. he will know because after the removal of the labia, the woman's vagina is stiched in such a way that leaves only a tiny opening for mentrail flow. When the man expands the hole during intercourse, he can be sure by the attendent copious amounts of pain inflicted, and blood and tears produced, that she has been a virgin up to this time.

[jomifl]

Andy, in this case what can be done can be undone and vice versa, so apparent virginity can be just an illusion.

[FredPuli43]

Hmm. "The prophet said "Do not cut too severely..."" So he wasn't against the practice of 'female circumcision'. He simply advised on the degree of cutting. That seems to be approval from the prophet himself, or has there been something lost in translation?

[andy-hughes]

jomifl - "Andy, in this case what can be done can be undone and vice versa, so apparent virginity can be just an illusion."

That statement completely contradicts what I said.

How can the removal of a child's labia and the following stiching, which will scar over until healed, and remain untouched until her first intercourse be 'undone'? I am intrigued.

[FredPuli43]

Good point,aog. There's surely nothing in the code of practice regarding patient confidentiality that prevents doctors and nurses reporting evidence of assault upon, or abuse of, a child. If there is, then the code goes too far. But, the chances are that the operation will have been carried out years before, or abroad, and so the prospects of getting anywhere in finding the offender and prosecuting are poor, quite apart from the culture barrier of silence and secrecy which exists. It would be a start, though.

[Brenden]

Islam would soon be altered if the men had to go through a parallel procedure carried out on them in the name of religion.

[jomifl]

AH, I was not referring to the excision of the labia, I was referring to the surgical partial closing of the vagina so that husband would 'know' that his wife was a virgin. If the vagina can be partially closed once then it can be done again. My apologies for not making this clear in my earlier post.

[andy-hughes]

Most of the world's religions would alter considerably if men were made to undergo what women suffer - we don't need to go abroad for that - we can start here with Catholicism.

[Ric.ror]

Why drag us in on this one Andy

[jomifl]

Keyplus, although FMG was being practised at the time of mohammed, it is not condemned in the koran. It is if anything condoned slightly. A quick search of google and youtube indicates that the more fervent muslims appear to approve of the practice. I have never thought that the more educated and modern muslims would approve of such a barbaric practice as FMG. The problem seems to be that unless the koran specifically condemns a practise (and often not even then) many poorly educated muslims seem to think it condones it.

[andy-hughes]

jomifl - thanks for the cliarification -

although I cannlt see a woman of puberty age - which is the age at which she might wish to conceal sexual activity - would dream of submitting to such a proceedure again, given that it was done to her when she was too young to have a say.

[jomifl]

AH, I have heard of women who were not virgins (however) having surgery so that they could pass themselves off as virgins in order to acquire a high status and/or wealthy husband.

[andy-hughes]

Doubt if they had that without either their consent, or some powerful anaesthetic!