ChatterBank1 min ago
Policeman Goes Berserk !
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I had to watch this twice until I believed what happened ! Apparently he was only given a community order. I presume that he is no longer a serving Policeman, but this looks to me like a serious assault. Shouldn't he have gone to jail ?
I had to watch this twice until I believed what happened ! Apparently he was only given a community order. I presume that he is no longer a serving Policeman, but this looks to me like a serious assault. Shouldn't he have gone to jail ?
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//Not a job that I would want to do. Everyone has a breaking point and I expect dealing with scrotes everyday would test the patience of a saint. //
If you decide to become a police officer , ( noone forced him to become one ) you have got to accept that you are required to uphold a high degree of integrity and professionlism .
Whether you are dealing with a ' scrote ' or not , is no excuse for that sort of behaviour .
If you can't control whatever urge you have to do something like this ; then you should urgently consider if you are in the right job
If you decide to become a police officer , ( noone forced him to become one ) you have got to accept that you are required to uphold a high degree of integrity and professionlism .
Whether you are dealing with a ' scrote ' or not , is no excuse for that sort of behaviour .
If you can't control whatever urge you have to do something like this ; then you should urgently consider if you are in the right job
an argument calling for the Met to be abolished
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Yes, order limit, the so-called independent Sentencing Council does seem to have, as a major part of its remit, the need to keep people out of prison. It is rare indeed for someone to be given a custodial sentence for Common Assault yet some examples of it are extremely unpleasant. (Some examples of it should actually be charged as ABH but the CPS, ever-mindful of the cost of going to trial, especially if the defendant opts for Crown Court, very often seem to under-charge with Common Assault. This either elicits a plea or, at the very least, removes the possibility of the matter going to the Crown Court).
Virtually every new guideline that is published downgrades the suggested sentences or introduces new variations of the offence which should be sentenced at a lower level. Not so long ago this particular incident would almost certainly result in custody.
Owen Jones’s article advocating the abolition of the Metropolitan Police makes interesting reading. Of course the incidents he describes do not show those individual officers concerned in a good light. His adulation of the Macpherson report is to be expected. My views on it are well known but in short some of its recommendations were ludicrous and far from advancing policing in London I believe in some respects it set it back 20 years and that setback has still not been recovered. However to suggest the organisation be abolished is a little hasty (not even Macpherson recommended that). He cites, as a reason, the Met’s dealing with protests saying their methods are “…symptomatic of a force that saw protest as something that had to be contained, not facilitated.” I think if you took a straw poll of people living and working in London you would almost certainly find that most of them want the police to contain protests so that they can go about their business. Hardly, then, a reason for abolition. He is also careful to promote no alternative to his slash-and-burn policy, simply saying that the issue of replacement “…should be left to a royal commission – headed by an independent figure,..”. All in all, very constructive.
Virtually every new guideline that is published downgrades the suggested sentences or introduces new variations of the offence which should be sentenced at a lower level. Not so long ago this particular incident would almost certainly result in custody.
Owen Jones’s article advocating the abolition of the Metropolitan Police makes interesting reading. Of course the incidents he describes do not show those individual officers concerned in a good light. His adulation of the Macpherson report is to be expected. My views on it are well known but in short some of its recommendations were ludicrous and far from advancing policing in London I believe in some respects it set it back 20 years and that setback has still not been recovered. However to suggest the organisation be abolished is a little hasty (not even Macpherson recommended that). He cites, as a reason, the Met’s dealing with protests saying their methods are “…symptomatic of a force that saw protest as something that had to be contained, not facilitated.” I think if you took a straw poll of people living and working in London you would almost certainly find that most of them want the police to contain protests so that they can go about their business. Hardly, then, a reason for abolition. He is also careful to promote no alternative to his slash-and-burn policy, simply saying that the issue of replacement “…should be left to a royal commission – headed by an independent figure,..”. All in all, very constructive.
"However to suggest the organisation be abolished is a little hasty (not even Macpherson recommended that)."
Well, to be fair, Macpherson was looking at specifics of MPS behaviour - namely the investigation of S. Lawrences murder and the more widely whether racism was endemic within the force. He was not tasked with determining whether the Met was fit for purpose. Had he been, and especially with evidence from the last decade or so of police misuse of powers, he might well have concluded that they were out of control and no longer commanded the respect of the public.
The Police operate on a principle of implied consent from the public. The behaviour of the Met have seriously eroded that public confidence and put that consent at risk. It is no great stretch from that to conclude that we might be better off taking a broom to the operation and bringing in some new blood.
"My views on it are well known but in short some of its recommendations were ludicrous and far from advancing policing in London I believe in some respects it set it back 20 years and that setback has still not been recovered"
Remind us again, NJ because I am a bit hazy now - what recommendations in the Macpherson report were in your opinion ludicrous? Which recommendations set back policing 20 years?
I personally have very little faith in the MPS nowadays, and I certainly disapprove with some of their tactics when it comes to handling demonstrations.
Well, to be fair, Macpherson was looking at specifics of MPS behaviour - namely the investigation of S. Lawrences murder and the more widely whether racism was endemic within the force. He was not tasked with determining whether the Met was fit for purpose. Had he been, and especially with evidence from the last decade or so of police misuse of powers, he might well have concluded that they were out of control and no longer commanded the respect of the public.
The Police operate on a principle of implied consent from the public. The behaviour of the Met have seriously eroded that public confidence and put that consent at risk. It is no great stretch from that to conclude that we might be better off taking a broom to the operation and bringing in some new blood.
"My views on it are well known but in short some of its recommendations were ludicrous and far from advancing policing in London I believe in some respects it set it back 20 years and that setback has still not been recovered"
Remind us again, NJ because I am a bit hazy now - what recommendations in the Macpherson report were in your opinion ludicrous? Which recommendations set back policing 20 years?
I personally have very little faith in the MPS nowadays, and I certainly disapprove with some of their tactics when it comes to handling demonstrations.
There are many of the seventy recommendations that I consider less than sound, LG, but top of the list is certainly number 12, together with number 14:
12. That the definition [of a racist incident] should be:
"A racist incident is any incident which is perceived to be racist by the victim or any other person".
14. That this definition should be universally adopted by the Police, local Government and other relevant agencies.
Among some of the others:
30. That Police Services and Victim Support Services ensure that their systems provide for the pro-active use of local contacts within minority ethnic communities to assist with victim support and with the handling and interviewing of sensitive witnesses.
(Why the special treatment for minority ethnic communities)
33. That the CPS should consider that, in deciding whether a criminal prosecution [of a racist crime] should proceed, once the CPS evidential test is satisfied there should be a rebuttable presumption that the public interest test should be in favour of prosecution.
(Why should racist crimes enjoy that privilege)
38. That consideration should be given to the Court of Appeal being given power to permit prosecution after acquittal where fresh and viable evidence is presented.
(I am fundamentally opposed to the removal of the “double jeopardy” rules and I believe it was introduced principally for this case because the Lawrence family had, against advice, brought a failed private prosecution)
Others are Nos 50, 64 and 65 (which deal with racism training and recruitment targets). These and those covering “Stop and Search” 60-63) certainly hampered effective police strategy and operations (as many serving police officers will confirm).
The Macpherson report is often hailed as a "defining moment" in UK policing. With its author exceeding his remit by a country mile, it was certyainly that.
12. That the definition [of a racist incident] should be:
"A racist incident is any incident which is perceived to be racist by the victim or any other person".
14. That this definition should be universally adopted by the Police, local Government and other relevant agencies.
Among some of the others:
30. That Police Services and Victim Support Services ensure that their systems provide for the pro-active use of local contacts within minority ethnic communities to assist with victim support and with the handling and interviewing of sensitive witnesses.
(Why the special treatment for minority ethnic communities)
33. That the CPS should consider that, in deciding whether a criminal prosecution [of a racist crime] should proceed, once the CPS evidential test is satisfied there should be a rebuttable presumption that the public interest test should be in favour of prosecution.
(Why should racist crimes enjoy that privilege)
38. That consideration should be given to the Court of Appeal being given power to permit prosecution after acquittal where fresh and viable evidence is presented.
(I am fundamentally opposed to the removal of the “double jeopardy” rules and I believe it was introduced principally for this case because the Lawrence family had, against advice, brought a failed private prosecution)
Others are Nos 50, 64 and 65 (which deal with racism training and recruitment targets). These and those covering “Stop and Search” 60-63) certainly hampered effective police strategy and operations (as many serving police officers will confirm).
The Macpherson report is often hailed as a "defining moment" in UK policing. With its author exceeding his remit by a country mile, it was certyainly that.
@NJ Thanks for the clarification. I would tend to agree with you on 12, I think - too woolly and imprecise and open.
For the others though - 30,33 and 38 I have no problem with.
The constant stream of stories about malfeasance by the police have left me far far less inclined to be co-operative with them, especially the constant stories of inappropriate use of force, continued stories of racism, allegations of corruption and the manner with which they approach the policing of demonstrations.
For the others though - 30,33 and 38 I have no problem with.
The constant stream of stories about malfeasance by the police have left me far far less inclined to be co-operative with them, especially the constant stories of inappropriate use of force, continued stories of racism, allegations of corruption and the manner with which they approach the policing of demonstrations.
i tend to agree, but sometimes they over react to certain situations,
i recall seeing 6 officers take on two drunks, this was in the middle of the day, the drunks weren't being offensive, but the coppers were completely out of order, they called for back up, so two more arrived on the scene, 8 officers who thought they were in an episode of the sweeney, totally uncalled for. The two inebriates were handcuffed, buffeted about, and bullied, i was standing not ten feet away from it, and wondered quite what i was witnessing. It doesn't help matters in regards to cordial relations with the police, though i do think generally the majority do a good job.
i recall seeing 6 officers take on two drunks, this was in the middle of the day, the drunks weren't being offensive, but the coppers were completely out of order, they called for back up, so two more arrived on the scene, 8 officers who thought they were in an episode of the sweeney, totally uncalled for. The two inebriates were handcuffed, buffeted about, and bullied, i was standing not ten feet away from it, and wondered quite what i was witnessing. It doesn't help matters in regards to cordial relations with the police, though i do think generally the majority do a good job.
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