Time To Cancel My Graun Subscription

[sunny-dave]

If I had a subscription to The Guardian (which I did have for many years) it would be being cancelled right now.

I've just read this 'leader' and it's possibly the most condescending, dismissive and plain wrong editorial that I've seen in a 'quality' newspaper for a long time.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/08/the-guardian-view-on-parliament-and-brexit-mps-fail-their-first-test

The total contempt for the democratic process and the desire to see the result of the referendum frustrated by MPs is quite astonishing.

When will the self-styled, self-serving metropolitan elite accept that (like it or not, and I'm not sure that I do) the country voted by a substantial majority to leave the EU and Parliament must be expected to carry through that result?

[ToraToraTora]

thechair - yawn, you sure you're not gromit in disguise? ok so on that basis only 41% of Scots voted to remain, see? it works both ways!

[Canary42]

Let me just say, as a staunch Remainer, I quite agree that, given the result of the referendum (although hardly "substantial majority"), Parliament must enact some form of real exit from EU. For any MP to try to block it per se is a dereliction of their duty.

The people have spoken, so here's one Remainer who won't support the Remoaners (even though they're only doing on their side what the Brexiteers have been doing for years and years and years)

[sunny-dave]

1. 52% of those who could be bothered to vote seems a decent majority - the rest get what they deserve.

2. In a parliamentary democracy, the will of parliament prevails. Always.

But when a parliament has authorised a referendum and agreed the wording of the question, then I expect that same parliament to ensure that the result is implemented - not cheese-pared or salami-sliced into something different.

If they can't bring themselves to do that, then we should have a General Election ... which will lead to some interesting choices.

I still think that a winning remain side would be pretty vocal if a rogue parliament was encouraged to vote for us to leave ...

[Canary42]

"I still think that a winning remain side would be pretty vocal if a rogue parliament was encouraged to vote for us to leave ..."

I'm sure you're right.

[anaxcrosswords]

Isn't all media skewed one way or another? Our mistake is to believe that its output is what we should think.
It's partly why I voted Remain. Yes, I thought it the better option, but even if I'd believed otherwise I would have voted the same. The whole journey between announcement of the referendum and the vote was biased, politicised, and often downright false information, from the £350m Bus of Lies to... well, pretty much everything, from all political parties as well as the media. Very few of us had a true picture of what the EU really is.
Put it this way. If I was the curator of some huge stately home in desperate need of renovation, I might have enough knowledge to narrow down its fresh look to style A or B. Would I then call in a team of architectural and design experts to decide, or go down the pub and ask my mates? They would know about as much as many of us knew about the EU.

[Jackdaw33]

Ask your mates.They will give mates' rates.

[jourdain2]

I gave up on the old Grauniad some years ago. It had become so London metro-centric (to my mind) and Araucaria had retired :(.

[Jackdaw33]

The late Araucaria was the only redeeming feature of the Grauniad. It was only when he died that I learnt that he was a clergyman.

[Old_Geezer]

Amazed at how many times here someone pretends others don't know the difference between Parliament and government; and having created the erroneous straw-man uses it to sneer at others rather that admit their mistake.

Good post at 17:06 SD. Tends to sum it up.

[jourdain2]

JD Araucaria was, I think, vicar of Long Preston in the Dales (in between Skipton and Settle). Every time I drove through there I tipped an imaginary hat to him.

[-Talbot-]

Why are you people so ignorant of the way your country is run? I blame the education system.



Nice!

[ABerrant]

"Referenda are advisory and though MPs will give them due weight they are in no way obliged to follow them."

"yes, jno, as I have said a thousand times, referendums are advisory, technically."


A referendum is advisory if it is formulated to be so. You must have forgotten the 2011 referendum on the Parliamentary Voting System (whether to ditch First Past The Post for Alternative Vote). The relevant Act stipulated...

'The Minister must make an order bringing into force ... the alternative vote provisions ... if ... more votes are cast in the referendum in favour of the answer “Yes” than in favour of the answer “No” ... [etc.]'

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2011/1/part/1/crossheading/result-of-the-referendum/enacted

[JohnnyAlpha]

Sorry, what 'substantial majority'?

[diddlydo]

Why are there so many right-wing fascists on this site? All power to the Guardian - the ONLY newspaper for thinking people.

[-Talbot-]

Don't bother with debate, didlydo. Come straight out with the fascists slur, wins the argument ever time ... Congratulations!

[eetpxa]

A once in a generation decision

The referendum on Thursday, 23 June is your chance to decide if we should remain in or leave the European Union.
....
This is your decision. The government will implement what you decide. ""

It seems pretty clear from the above that the 'you' referred to is you (singular), referring to myself personally. Still waiting for them to implement my decision......

[Aurisaria]

Democracy? That's a laugh

[Baldric]

This one always gets me,

///37% of those entitled to vote, voted for Brexit. Hardly a substantial majority///

It was the % of those who actually bothered to get off their backsides and vote that counts.